Anonymous8

apostasy Just FYI

6 If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers;

7 Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth;

8 Thou shalt not consent unto him, nor hearken unto him; neither shall thine eye pity him, neither shalt thou spare, neither shalt thou conceal him:

9 But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people.

10 And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die; because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the Lord thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

-YT 

And lastly...

And yes, we do care and are compassionate about people getting raped in America and elsewhere, but again, we face a formidable enemy in the IRI, we have our freaking hands FULL as Iranians!!! My country's ONE BIG PRISON, and everybody, including my friends and family -- my blood! -- is getting RAPED and murdered daily -- SO EXCUSE ME FOR CARING JUST A LITTLE MORE ABOUT MY FREAKING HOMELAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I submit to you all that those charlatans amongst us espousing "compassionate" ideas about other downtrodden people of the world are in reality spinning their desperate muslim mojo, in an underhanded and deceptive attempt to take the HEAT off of Islam and its massive crimes against humanity.

It's not that the captains of the world care one bit about the people of Rwanda, it's in all likelihood a case of misdirection -- a case of blatantly manufactured emotions -- an obvious attempt at trying to obfuscate the real issues haunting our homeland, which almost always have to do with the fascist religion of Islam.

Nice try!

LONG LIVE IRAN, FREE OF ISLAMIC FASCISM 

Compassion

Capt_ayhab wrote: “With all due respect, one either has compassion or not, isn’t that true?”

Yes, the compassion does exist even in my cold heart. However, how far does this compassion go? How is it manifested in my daily life?

I neither have the time nor the resources to change the world. As a matter of fact, I will be quite content if I can have a minuscule influence on the course of my nation’s history before I die.

Although the grandeur aspiration of global peace and harmony is appealing to every kindred spirit, the reality dictates to us all to pick our battles wisely and effectively. I’ve got a bone to pick with Islam…

I feel like I am an Ayatoflah now ;-)

Natalie: a Muslim woman must only marry a Muslim man. However, a Muslim man (as you can guess) can do almost anything and anyone he wishes ;-)

Dear Vildemose: 

Amre-Be-Maroof va Nahe-Az-Monker: is a must for any Muslim to tell other Muslims what the Allah's way is, and to prevent them (if needed forcefully) from breaking the Allah's way.

""One of the Islam’s

""One of the Islam’s principle pillars is the “Amr-e be Maroof and Nahy az Monker” Amr means “ordering” and Nahy means “preventing”. This principle is basically the terror aspect of Islam.

On this basis, terrorising the society is encouraged and authorised by the religion. According to this principle a Muslim is under the obligation to order another to adhere to the Islamic ways and if ineffective take measures to prevent the unislamic act from taking place.

According to the Islamic directions, this action is necessary even if it means losing one’s life or taking others’ lives.  Imam Hussein lost his life while carrying out this principle.

A few years ago,  in a cinema in Iran a man killed and injured another and claimed that he was carrying out the “Amr-e be Maroof and Nahy az Monker”. It is clear that the man was counselled and procured by the Islamic teachings and directions.

 However, the Islamic regime, in order not to prosecute the man declared the man “mental”!  He escaped prosecution! ""

Can someone explain this aspect of Islam to me? Is it true or not? 

Yikes! I shall have to make sure that she remains in the U.S.

She does believe in prayer but she doesn't exactly do it the Muslim way

ناتاليا

Apostasy in Islam

When a Muslim denunciates Islam, both Sunni and Shi'a Islamic jurisprudence agree that “a sane adult male apostate must be executed.” However, some scholars of Islamic jurisprudence favor life imprisonment for a female apostate. Others prescribe a death sentence.

Although many verses of Qur'an have been used to justify the death penalty, these verses only state that Allah will “punish and reject” the apostates “in the afterlife.” Hence, the majority of Islamic jurists base the death punishment on a hadith.

The appropriate method of death for an apostate is beheading. Additionally, all schools of Islamic jurisprudence confer that a Muslim may kill an apostate without fear of punishment.

I Say HELL NO!

To PAN ISLAMIC , POLITICAL and SHARIA LAW ISLAM!!! Keep your ISLAM (or any religion) in Masjids (or place of worship) and your homes not in the government and don't be pushing it down people throats and up their asses for that matter in their personal daily lives. 

BE PROUD OF WHATEVER YOU WANT, BUT RESPECT OTHERS BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS!

I see...thank you

Now, I know that she is expected to only marry a Muslim man. Is this a correct assessment?

Natalie

If a Muslim man or woman gives up the key practices of Islam, e.g. daily prayer, fasting, etc - then that person is considered to be on the verge of Apostasy. The line is crossed, if that person declares that s/he does think that obeying those creeds is necessary.

For example, if you intentionally don't say prayers for three days, most Mullah's say that you are out of religion. But you can claim that you had a good reason for that lapse, and that reason is between you and your god. Next, they can ask you: do you believe that you should pray? If you say "yes, I should and will pray"; you are theoretically good to go. However, if you say "no, there is no need to pray in this day and age", then you are good for the gallows!

So say if she was a Muslim convert but not a practicing one

What would be the verdict on her? Hypothetically speaking, she lives in the U.S.

dear gitdoun: you are so simply mistaken - apostasy = death

Go read any one of the Shia cleric's Tozih-ol-Masael.

Go read the verdicts by the Egyptian clerics of Al-Azhar.

Kid, you are way out of your league here, my grandfather was a mullah and I have read that crap inside out!

Why do you think the Baha'i are being persecuted so vigorously in Iran?

From Khomeini's T-o-M:

1. The case of a born Muslim becoming apostate is clear: should be killed by any Muslim who has the means to do that! Even if s/he repents, it is not accepted in this world. Allah may or may not forgive him/er after death though ;-) This was the basis for the verdict against Salman Rushdie.

2. The case of a Muslim convert, who was originally a non-Muslim: should be killed by any Muslim who has the means to do so. S/he can repent and would be forgiven, once, twice, three times (there is some debate among the Ayatoflah's about this). However, if s/he persists on going back, then the verdict is death.

hello

people who keep referring to execution for apostasy. please scroll down and read my post as this is explained in detail. kindly refrain from slurs and smear campaigns --thanks

Siavash31

Iranians inside are numbed by 30 years of repression and propaganda. Non of things they say makes any sense. I bet themselves don't understand a thing about what they are saying. What you call 'tolerance' I call numbness.

Perhaps you can be a bridge and enlighten us with their thoughts. I read the blogs. I read the political messages. They just don't make any sense. I read your own description of flag bearer protesters in Toronto. Even the word 'tolerance' has lost its meaning. Your scene description in Toronto gathering looked more like a well behaved civilized white people gathered to discuss the productivity of their plantations, only to be rudely disrupted by a bunch of savage niggers. Where was your effort toward tolerance?

You ask everyone to forget about Iranians abroad and focus on Iranians inside the country. Yet you do this in a forum of Iranians abroad. Then perhaps it's better to introduce us to thoughts and minds of Iranians inside so that we could better focus on them. After all, this is what we all fight for... Iran.

//iranian.com/main/blog/sayeh-hassan/sham...

Ms. Gillani

You stated[I put my energy and vigor into exposing the crimes committed by Muslims
simply because my homeland is suffering in the clutches of an Islamic government.]

Rightfully so I might add, however, how can one show compassion for some and deny it from others. Simply put, can a parent love ON LY one of his/her children.

How can one say i care about my sisters getting raped in the dungeons of IR, but not care about millions of women who are raped in Rwanda, or the 4000 plus women who are raped DAILY in USA?

Do we not so proudly say [Bani Adam azaie yek digarand?]. With all due respect, one either has compassion or not, isn't that true?

-YT 

I'm still waiting for some

I'm still waiting for some devout muslim to explain the true Islam to me. I'm waiting for someone to challenge those so-called Islamphobes with well-reasoned arguments and verifiable facts to the counter their "libelous" and "hateful" allegations.

Incivility and name-calling ( both sides) will not enhance our understanding and will not contribute to resolving any of our current problems we face.

Ok An8: I am a proud Iranian ex-muslim. Am I allowed out?

Your fascist ideology says that I should be killed, because I want to simply choose my faith freely.

Do you and the rest of Information Ministry boys agree with my right to leave Islam peacefully (in which case you have to go against one of the pillars of Islamic creeds), or do you plan to kill me?

Singling out Muslims

Capt_ayhab wrote: “Final request, Kindly demonstrate same rhetoric and bashing[lake of a better word] about all the responsible parties you named, i.e. Jews for Palestine, Christians for ALL the wars, Germans, for Nazi's etc etc, and lets not SINGLE out only Muslims.”

I put my energy and vigor into exposing the crimes committed by Muslims simply because my homeland is suffering in the clutches of an Islamic government.

My calling is to free my Iran; the rest is out of my reach.

anonymous8

First, why do you post anonymously? why do you reply to your own post and back your original post under other anonymous names?  why do people hate you as a Muslim?  I visited Iran few years a go for the First time.  I was sent away right before the revolution at a young age but always wanted to go back because I love Iran and I have siblings that still live there. My brother's wife (from Shomal) an ex Muslim whom converted to Christianity hated Islam for all the horrible things people did to her and her family under the name Islam. I myself was raised as Christian but do not practice Christianity BUT I believe strongly that "doing the right thing, loving and forgiving is the way of life" (BTW, Jesus promoted that also and got killed for it, so did Socrates) and one needs not to be religion to practice the right way of life. Do you live rightfully? If you are not harming anyone then why are you hated?!!!!! That is a question you should ask yourself not others!  Thanks.

shad zee

yana

Ms. Gillani

Although I do not agree with most of your ideas but in all fairness I have to hand to you for being consistent in your quest for [Collective Punishment/Collective Responsibility] , and I assure you I mean what I say, I respect you for it, while being totally opposed to it.

Thanks for your reply madam.

-YT 

P/S Final request, Kindly demonstrate same rhetoric and bashing[lake of a better word] about all the responsible parties you named, i.e. Jews for Palestine, Christians for ALL the wars, Germans, for Nazi's etc etc, and  lets not SINGLE out only Muslims. ;-)

Mr. Lance Raheem

You noted[Ask all the male and female prisoners who were raped in Iranian prisons by security agents why they hate your religion.]

Excellent point, however lets be fair, shall we?

While WE are busy asking those questions, can you please pay a visit to Abu Gharib, and Gitmo and ask the same question from those people who were tortured, water boarded, belittled and even raped in front of their MOTHERS. Once you done, will you be kind enough to tell everyone who are we supposed to hate-as a group- for the acts committed by those few culprits.

Regards

-YT 

Who is Responsible?

capt_ayhab wrote: “Do you hold responsible the entire groups I mentioned for the acts that were committed by persons named? Why or why not?”

Yes, I hold Christian and Jewish fundamentalist groups responsible. In short, any ideology that advocates violence towards non believers is ultimately responsible for the actions of the believers.

Mr. Siavash31

Dude you nailed the jest of the matter when you said[ The people in Iran are FAR more tolerant, mature, peaceful, confident,
spiritual and rational than the hateful, lost, confused, angry, insecure, arrogant and over-emotional Iranians that you encounter
outside the country.]

That makes PEOPLE in Iran more democratic minded than most of us who CLAIM to be living in a democratic country. For some reason, most of the HATERS abroad feel like freedom of speech equates spreading hate and bigotry. Examples of such people are abound in this site, regretfully said. Most of these people abroad have an ugly distorted view of freedom of speech, they bash and spread hate about Muslims, yet they do not have the gulls to say the same thing , same exercise of free speech about other religions and other races.

They know that behavior like that will land them in jail, or be shunned from society along with groups such as KKK and Anti Semites. Spreading hatred is an unlawful act in many states in US and many countries in Europe, YET the governments allow these haters and bigots smear Muslims and spread hatred about Muslims, under the distorted name of freedom of expression.

I dare any of these Islamofobias to utter ONE such word about Jews, blacks, gays or anyone else and watch  what happens to them.

Double standard and hypocrisy abound my dear hamvatan :(

Regards

-YT 

Ms. Gillani

Thanks for your reply, however you still have not answered the questions I asked.

Do you hold responsible the entire groups I mentioned for the acts that were committed by persons named?

Why and why not.

Respectfully

-YT 

Anonymous8

May I suggest you do what I did: just forget about the Iranians abroad and focus on the people in Iran.

The people in Iran are FAR more tolerant, mature, peaceful, confident, spiritual and rational than the hateful, lost, confused, angry, insecure, arrogant and over-emotional Iranians that you encounter outside the country.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that all Iranian abroad are bad and all Iranians inside are good. But trust me, in general people in Iran are much more connected to their roots and much more comfortable with who they are. So, they don't attack others to feel better about themselves.

Do you want to know why?

Do you want to know why people around the world find it diffiult to separate Muslims from the hateful ideaology? It's because every time a suicide bomber blows himself up in the name of Islam, be it 9/11 or 7/7 or the Madrid bombings, we don't see these moderate peaceful majorty Muslims take into the streets and denounce the heineous actions and say it loud and clear: "Not in our names, not in the name of Islam."

I am not talking about the mini pittiful rallies that are organized in the Western countries by the so called Islamic organizations either because they are probably scared shitless of the backlash. I am talking about the real Muslims in the Middle East.

But God forbid, a cartoonist draws a couple of lines of a piece of paper and watch how they mobilize! Give me a fucking break!!!

It's your own brothers that are hurting your religion and its image not people like us.

I can't be;lieve the amount of venom here

I have lived with Muslims most of my life and haven't seen any atrocity committed by them that you guys subscribe to Muslims collectively, just because you have chosen to subject yourselves to IRI for 30 years.

So, if someone jumps a red light you go bashing the traffic light!

There are many verses in Quran which exhorts Muslims to be kind, charitable, forgiving, pious, mindful, etc, and majority of such acts are not defined to be towards Muslims only but humanity at large.

I am familiar with the negative verses mentioned here but you must take them in the context they were inspired, which was during war times. Your wonderful free America creates wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and then says we are at war, giving themselves the right to trample on their own constitution; heard of Balckwater! and the hundreds of collateral damages promised to be seen to! Only a couple of atrocious acts have been brought to courts for expediency sake.

Lack of respect for ordinary folk is something no Persian can be proud of, no matter what. Majority of Iranians are Muslims; or may be you have lived away for too long; what 20 years? Here is news: a country of 70 millions does not change its religion in 20 years!

And yes Islam has freed me and sure it has enslaved millions but such is the way of all religious dogma, it has the tendency to enslave; but to anyone who understands; it is better to be enslaved to spiritual goodness and then find freedom through that, than be enslaved to humans, flags, nationality, bondage, fashion, capitalism, socialism, communism, any other transient ism.

Ba ihteram be hammeh. Whether you have faith or none whatsoever; whether you are straight gay or lesbian; I for one love you no matter what, and respect you for who you are. And yes there are Muslims like me, who love all humanity and contribute to many none-Islamic charities. It ill-behoves me to brag but give this stereo-typing a break.

Ahmed from Bahrain

Kaveh V

You wrote;

"This is what your holly book says:

“Prophet, make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites, and deal sternly with them.  Hell shall be their home, evil their fate.” [sura 66:8] "

CAN YOU PROVE THIS IS WHAT THE ORIGINAL QURAN SAID or maybe it is an assumption of the translator?

FARAMARZ FATEH!

You are an idiot ! i am sorry.

fantastic contributions!

As I read some of the comments below, I was literally alarmed how poingnant, perceptive and wickedly sharp they were! Some of the stuff written in this blog is the best I've seen on Iranian.com -- BY FAR!!! Below, I've gathered some of the most insightful, delicious passages from this, all-too illuminting, blog. 

TheMrs. --

How can I be proud of something that I had nothing to do with getting?!

But the REAL question is, why do you even want to be here? Don't you know "Nothing is sacred" here????

LalehGillani --

"The fact that other religions have or haven’t committed any atrocities holds no bearing on the responsibility of Islam and Muslims towards what is happening in our country."

"My focus and energy is devoted to my homeland and its future. Believe it or not, my calling isn’t to bring peace and prosperity to the world!"  

massoudA --

"Religion is just a tool - a tool for enlightenment and to get to God.   You can love God or Enlightenment - but one must not love the tool."

Kaveh V --

“Prophet, make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites, and deal sternly with them.  Hell shall be their home, evil their fate.” [sura 66:8] 

benross --

"Islam does not own Iran."

Sohraby --

"Even the name “Islam” is a derivation of “tasliem,” the tazi (Arab) word for “surrender,” surrender to whom?"

Babak Khorramdin --

"Better to live for just a single day as a ruler than to live for forty years as an abject slave."

LanceRaheem --

"Ask all the male and female prisoners who were raped in Iranian prisons by security agents why they hate your religion.  Ask the parents of all the hanged children over the past thirty years why they hate your religion.  Ask all the women (and not those hags wrapped in black rags) that your kind have reduced to second class citizens why they hate your religion.  Ask all the decent hard-working Iranians who have watched your fellow Muslim comrades rob the country blind for thirty years why they hate your religion." 

LONG LIVE IRAN, DEATH TO ISLAMIC FASCISM