Iranian of the Day

Query

Can anyone find a confirmed statement in the media, from those around Neda, giving details about this id card.

I find it strange that no verifiable statement has been made - despite all the stories about Neda in recent days, and numerous interviews with her friends and associates. The idea that this is the person concerned comes from anonymous blog postings.

X programmer craig

i agree with you that perhaps there is little likelihood currently that this guy if guilty will be prosecuted or that Iran would cooperate with the ICC.  (There must have been good reasons for Uncle Sam to have exempted itself, no?!)  However, as I have said before, the question is not the punishment of one or more individuals, the question is the exposure, and that would happen whatever the response of the IR.  In fact the more resistant to the execution of justice, the starker the exposure.  Another and in fact the more important issue, is that even if he might escape justice, if the process of justice is not pursued, and if an innocent person is brutalized ad murdered, that will be a irascible stain on the human rights records of the Green movement in Iran. There is no excuse for killing an innocent man, or in fact punishing a guilty man arbitrarily and over and beyond what the law dictates.  Even a guilty criminal has rights in a civilized society.  For me, respect for universal human rights and justice is the most important criteria for supporting any movement and at the centre of any consideration for rebuilding Iran.  What would be the point of any struggle if we dehumanize our fellow humans and dehumanize ourselves in the process?  

Innocent until proven guilty, and guilty too has rights.  Nothing short of this is worth fighting for.

Fouzul Bashi

This guy's name and picture came out of nowhere, there is no proof of
his guilt, the eyewitness said he resembles the guy who ran off...

There's a little more reason than that to believe this may in fact the man who shot Neda. This was posted here almost a month ago:

//iranian.com/main/news/2009/06/25/iran-d...

And following that link to the BBC article goes here:

//news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8119713.stm

And in that article, you can find this:

"People shouted 'we got him, we got him'. They disarmed him and took
out his identity card which showed he was a Basij member. People were
furious and he was shouting, 'I didn't want to kill her'.

"People
didn't know what do to do with him so they let him go. But they took
his identity card. There are people there who know who he is. Some
people were also taking photos of him."

If that ID card shown in this post is the ID card this Doctor spoke of last month, then this man is the likely suspect.

But I agree with you that vigilante justice is not the answer. It is unlikely he will be brought to trial in Iran, though, wouldn't you agree? So what are the alternatives? Some sort of international court? Do you think the IRI would comply, if the ICC issued an indictment? Would the IRI allow witnesses to be subpoenaed? And to travel to the Hague, for as long as the trial might take?  

I think that'd be great. Not only would he get a fair trial, but it might make other thugs think twice before they attack innocent people.

Human Rights

Human rights is not conditional. Even a murderer who rapes and kills his victim(s) in cold blood and then eats them is entitled to his day in court because his guilt has to be proven.

This guy's name and picture came out of nowhere, there is no proof of his guilt, the eyewitness said he resembles the guy who ran off after the shooting and as far as any of us knows somebody might have a grudge against him, or wants him to pay for something he did to them unrelated to Neda. 

How can anyone go by unsubstantiated accusations and convict someone from thousands of miles away without having had a fair trial, is beyond me. Then again I have seen more stupid nonsense coming out of some of the people's comments here.  Nevermind!

The Killer

I am all for capital punishment in cases of heinous crime such as murder, rape and child molestation. Call me barbarian see if I care. But in case of this murderer, once he is put on trial[preferably court marshal for crimes against Iranian people] him and his kind should not be put to death.

They should bare the hardest punishment for as long as they live. For god only knows how many Neda's or Sohrab's he has killed in cold blood. 

Who should give them the punishment? the family of the victim, Sohrabs weeping mother, Neda's Mother and mothers of 40 other brave souls who were murdered by these animals:

1. Abolfazl Abdollahi (21 years Diploma in EE June 30 2009)
2. Neda Aghasoltan (Student Tehran 20 June 2009)
3. Vahed Akbari (34 years married with a 3-year-old girl Tehran June 30 2009)
4. Kaveh Alipour(Tehran15 June 2009)
5. Naser Amirnejad (Aerospace PhD student Tehran U.14 June 2009)
6. Sohrab Arabi(Tehran June 2009)
7. Mohammad Asgari (IT department Interior Ministry TehranJune 2009)
8. Kianoosh Assa (chemistry student at Elm va Sanaat University Tehran June 2009)
9. Fatemeh Barati (Tehran June 20)
10. Yagoub Barvayeh( masters degree student in Theater at Tehran University June 2009)
11. Sarvar Boroumand (Tehran June 25 2009)
12. Mobina Ehterami (Tehran June 20)
13. Mostafa Ghanian (Graduate student Tehran U.14 June 2009)
14. Mohsen Hadadi (24-year-old computer programmer Tehran June 30 2009)
15. Iman Hashemi (Tehran June 30 2009)
16. Masoud Hashem-Zadeh (Tehran June 30 2009)
17. Farzad Hashti( Tehran June 2009)
18. Mohammad Hossein Barzegar (Tehran June 27 2009)
19. Mohsen Imani ( Tehran June 20)
20. Seyed-Farzad Jashni (Abdanan from Ilam province lost in Tehran June 30 2009)
21. Bahman Jenabi (Shop worker Tehran20 June 2009)
22. Mehdi Karami( killed in Jonat Abad Street Tehran15 June 2009)
23. Shalar Khazri (Tehran June 2009)
24. Masoud Khosravi (Tehran June 25 2009)
25. Parisa Koli (25-year-old general Graduated literature Tehran June 31 2009)
26. Hamid Maddah Shorcheh (Mashhad June 2009)
27. Iman Namazi (student at Tehran University June 25 2009)
28. Nader Nasseri (Tehran June 30 2009)
29. Mohammad Nikzadi ( 22 year old graduate in Civil Tehran June 26 2009)
30. Fatemeh Rajabpour and Her daughter (Tehran15 June 2009)
31. Davood Sadri (Karaj June 2009)
32. Fahimeh Salahshoor ( 25 years Tehran June 24 2009)
33. Ali Shahedi ( 24 years Tehranpars after arrest June 31 2009)
34. Kasra Sharafi (Tehran June 20)
35. Kambiz Shojaii (Tehran June 20)
36. Ashkan Sohrabi Student (Tehran20 June 2009)
37. Seyed-Reza Tabatabaii ( 30-year accounting degree Tehran June 30 2009)
38. Vahid-Reza Tabatabaii (29 years BA in English Tehran July 3 2009)
39. Salar Tahmasbi (27 years student of Business Administration Rasht June 30 2009)
40. Hossein Tahmassebi (25 was beaten to death in Kermanshah 20 June 2009)

Rest in peace Iran's brave daughters and sons. Your motherland will avenge your blood, she always has.

-YT 

hamsade ghadimi

Having the same fate as boz bozak who never saw spring, is one thing, but i seriously think that one of the goals of these protestors is to change the system in order to. sometime in the near future have a similar justice system. I really don't think that is too much to ask, and if that was not one of the goals, it would be a waste of time being on the streets protesting.

assal b

first of all, i don't agree that iranians are less rational than other human beings, whether it's about politics or other matters. second of all, you responded to my comment where i said criminals should be exposed by implying that i'm condoning raping, killing and torturing alleged criminals. why do you feel the need to exaggerate to demonstrate your points?

lastly, you should familiarize yourself with differences of iranian justice system from those in civilized countries. even in the u.s., the picture of an alleged killer is published before they are tried. this person is not and nor will he be arrested for this crime even if he's guilty of the crime and the iranian justice system knows about it. if we expect that criminals against humanity in iran will be brought to justice with the ideals that we have here, then the protesters in iran will have the same fate of the 'boz bozak who never saw the spring.' are you saying that we shouldn't even expose those who allegedly kill, rape, and torture the peaceful protesters?

Assal B

You may not deserve to be rediculed based on your opinions, but no one has the right to make a medical diagnosis over the interner. With all due respect, what you did was nothing short of insulting H. ghadimi. You say that you are not here to "bicker", But you tend to forget that one of the essentials of a healthy debate is refraining from using any kind of deragetory and potentially degrading comments.

Frankly the argument that you make for restorative justice, is really a fantasy and in some particular cases has no chance of coming to fruition. The first thing that you should pay attention to is the fact that it was reported from day one that this was the person who was captured by the people and his personal ID was taken in while he kept on saying he did not want to kill neda. He did not mean for it to happen, but Ooopsie. he did kill her, Do you want a more solid proof than that? Also. There are some criminals that simply can not be re-integrated back into the society, and they end up becoming repeat offenders. Should our society endure the risk? should we endanger our own children and loved ones, By convincing ourselves that "no matter what the crime" we have to spend time and resources on certain criminal, just so he or she can go back and start messing people's lives?

The basijis may not all be killers, But look at them for what and who they are, They are not just following a corrupt system, because they are being told to do so, They actually believe in it. They all have families, But guess what, They are the same people who gather around in a town or city square watching and clapping and cheering when an innocent kid is sent up the gallows and is executed needlessly. How do you justify that type of mentality? Some of them don't even need instructions from the Gov, and if they could take the laws into their own hands, they would hang people, who in their mind seem to be corrupt and deviant, with their own bare hands. Can't you see that they CHOOSE this way of living? that they choose to kiss the back of the hand of so many Ayatollahs for so many dumb and retarded reasons? They have made their choice and they certainly show it with all their hearts and souls.

We should see them as human beings, But at the same time we should impose them the punishment they so rightfully deserve and either way, anything that we do them does not mean that we do not deserve the democracy and Justice we have been striving for. A crime is a crime and the criminal MUST be punished. An entire society, especially the one that has been under stricly oppressive rules for 3 decades, should not be judged as to whether it does or does not deserve a "better future" based on the kind of action it takes againts the oppressors.

Are you suggesting that we should offer them a round-trip all-inclusive package to the Bahamas, when the table has turned and they are no longer in charge?

Good ! So they found him!

After our all Iranian true revolution becomes victorious, we shall arrest killers like him and sentence them to the full extend of democratic laws in our beloved Motherland...

Neda jaan, Rest In Peace, We will never forget you in Iran! And criminals like your killer will pay! One by one! We promise you that our brave and innocent daughter of Iran. We shall Free Iran and all Iranians from forces of evil! GOD is on our side...

Dear Satarah & Asal

I agree with U. Unfortunately The so called Iranian like ... was a Savaki yesterday, is a Basiji today and who knows what tomorrow. Human rights is for everyone not just the one we like!!!

Hamsadeh ghadimi -human rights is not an academic luxury, sir!

Did  you read the comments before starting the sermon?   If you take note, in relation to the comments by Mr Parviz and Mr Madjid, I stated that the due process of justice must apply irrespective of the IR's respect for it.  Due process of justice, means 'innocent until proven guilty' and 'right to defence' and 'rightful legal representation'.  You say that people in Iran have not sought violence, that "we have not witnessed any such behavior, in fact, to the contrary we have seen the peaceful demonstrators protecting these agents when they were befallen to the hands of the people".  Exactly, and that is how a civilised nation behaves, a point you don't seem very happy about!  

Assal B - Thank you for your concern and humanity. As for those who consider these principles academic preoccupations, you don't have Iran's best interest at heart, neither do you respect human rights, that is, the same stick with which you beat the IR.  

Hamsade Ghadimi

FYI: Expressing an opinion different from yours does not mean I am sitting on any high horse. If you took my comments personally and thought my comments were a little too uppity for your taste, that's a psychological shortcoming on your part that you'll need to deal with through some sort of counseling.

I'm not here to bicker although there is absolutely nothing wrong with healthy debate. That is what everyone is fighting for these days, isn't it---democracy and freedom and such?

To address the comment of everyone eventually wanting "justice", I agree. The problem is that Iranians as a people tend to be less rational and more ants-in-the-pants when it comes to politics. In deciding between restorative and retributive justice, I fear they will all go the eye-for-an-eye route. It's restorative justice that we need to strive for, the justice that is rooted in the belief that the offender can be successfully reintegrated into society. Yes, whoever killed Neda was wrong, but in highlighting and calling out someone as her alleged killer when we really have no facts, we are acting as the mullahs do---making accusations first, humiliating the untried, calling him guilty before he's allowed the chance to be proven innocent. If we begin doing this to people---no matter what their crimes, we are damaging our own society's future chance to reintegrate the "offenders" back into society.

I'm not saying killers shouldn't be tried for their crimes; they should. But, the basijis aren't all killers. They aren't all going be carted off to prison or shot in a line when the supposed-new revolution comes. They are human beings, following a corrupt system, who have wives and kids at home, mouths to feed, football games to watch, kids to put through school, birthday parties to celebrate, food to cook---they are human beings. If we don't see them as such, we aren't worthy of the better future we strive for.

That's my humble opinion and I have a right not to be ridiculed or put down for it.

assal b

who talked about beating, torturing, killing our tormenters? all i said was exposing. is it wrong to expose someone for allegedly killing someone?  i'm against capital punishment myself. get down from your mighty steed and read others' comment more carefully.

eventually after exposing these criminals, we want justice. however, even if this person killed neda, he probably got a promotion and is secure and safe with his family.  if you like to have a debate by yourself, that is fine. just assume the worst of what anyone could think and debate it to smitherines.

I pray for the tortured not to become the torturers.

There is supposed to be a difference between civilized and uncivilized people.

I don't care how many years you've been raped, you don't go out and rape someone.

I don't care how many times you've been beaten, you don't go around carrying a big baseball bat, ready to bash heads.

I don't care how many times you've been humiliated, you don't humiliate.

There is SUPPOSED to be a difference between you all, and them.

I won't put myself in the equation, because in reading most of the comments below and in seeing this post which goes against every single value Iranians are supposedly striving for....I don't feel like I want to be associated with any of it, not anymore.

Freedom and the rule of law can wait, you argue? Wait until after we've kicked the asses of and jailed and killed off all the "bad guys"?

You know what we'll be left with?

New bad guys and empty ideals and slogans.

people, people, it just cant be...

... the government announced that no military, police or basij used weapons against the people. it's the western and zionist killers and agents!

but seriously, i agree that the title should read “alleged” killer (thanks for the author to correct it). with respect to the politically correct opinions on whether we should publicize these alleged monsters who are acting as agents for the brutal iri regime, i have to disagree with the premise of their argument. while these commentators are worried that the situation will spin out of control and the people will act as vigilantes creating the “rule of the jungle”; we have not witnessed any such behavior, in fact, to the contrary we have seen the peaceful demonstrators protecting these agents when they were befallen to the hands of the people.

those who want the iranian residents and expatriates to treat the enemy (iri and its agents) according to laws of civilized countries should be reminded that the american revolutionaries who fought the british were branded as terrorists who used dishonorable tactics in their effort.  they should also be reminded that there are scores of the brightest minds of iran who have been killed, raped, arrested and tortured by these elements while the dissenters and those who support them simply want to expose these elements.  also, if the politically correct people are admonishing others not to break laws in their dissent, they should also be reminded that it is against the law in iran to dissent.

kudos to all for their wonderful short humanitarian essays and comments which deserves nothing less than an ‘a plus’ in a classroom by the conscientious professor.  but next time, let’s put the argument in the context of iranian uprising.

مهرداد عزیز

من این عکس را مقداری تنظیم کرده که دوستان بهتر بتوانند این شخص را ببینند - عکس تنظیم شده در این بلاگ می باشد - ممنونم ...

Shouldn't this read "alleged killer"

don't we need to be careful not to become what we are trying to get rid of?  Lets not replace one "rule of jungle" with another "rule of jungle"

Mehrdad

Dear Saman

Thank you for seeing the point I am making and for being so kind ..

This is a sheshmak for you ;)

ای کشته کرا کشتی تا کشته شدی زار       تا باز که او را بکشد آنکه ترا کشت؟  

Dear Parviz, It is Winking Star ;)

I referred to universal principles of justice.  This means that when someone is suspected or accused of a crime, you allow the person the right and means to defend themselves, before you sentence them; it means you do not mete out arbitrary punishment.  What you are referring to is not revolutionary justice, it is mob violence, because who is going to decide in such circumstances whether a person is guilty, whether there is enough evidence, and what punishment there should be?  Who is deciding, me, you, my next door neighbor, or a crowd that happen to capture him and who might on the sentiment of the moment decide to tear him into pieces?  I am referring to universal principles of justice and no amount of violence on the part of the IR justifies responding with the law of jungle.  

I agree that exposure to violence, overwhelming trauma, need for revenge, as well as mob psychology, blinds people's judgement and leads to violent reactions, and these responses may be inevitable sometimes, but a reactive violent response of this nature is an insane response which might be understood but it remains what it is, insane.  

To me what inspires the desire for change is to build a more humane society which to me indicates real civility.  I do not believe that it is possible to get anything remotely better than the IR, if not considerably worse, if we do not observe the first principles of respect for universal human rights and justice.

Have I heard of Nazi Germany?  Yes!  The violence and the trauma its victims suffered lives on .. in the continued suffering of other innocent victims, who will pass it on in continued violence.  

If we are to effect a change it better be for the better! 

What a humanitarian!

I suggest IRI supporters and lackeys on this web site to take this guy out for a drink. You guys will probably find a good common ground. He ain't a bad looking guy either for all you ume kolsom supporters!

Setareh...

We need more models like you in our community. It's obvious that you've had a decent and healthy upbringing.

Setareh Cheshmakzan!

Dear "Blinking star",

I am well aware of and all for the principles you mentioned in your post. It is nice to act and behave civilized and proper but that is unfortunately only possible in societies where the system is based on justice for all.

When you are dealing with a regime who

- does not even respect the laws (however backward and barbaric) created by its own organs and written into its constitution

- holds no value for the life and property of those who oppose it (even by peaceful means)

- does not see the need to answer to anybody or anything

- keeps abusing, torturing and killing people just to ensure its filthy existence

You would be very naive if you think by simply exposing these atrocities and alienating this regime from the population, you are going to get a better society. IRI has been alienated from the majority of Iranian people for almost 30 years now.

The only thing that can ensure a civilized society where things are conducted according to humane and just laws is the overthrow of this regime. Continuation of this regime in the name or form of likes of Rafsanjani , Mousavi or any similar criminal(s) is a myth and is not going to happen. People are not going to fall for that again. Religion and politics should be separated.

And if you think a civil society can be achieved in Iran through obeying IRI laws, then we are in for at least another 30 years of this barbaric regime.

I say criminals should be "punished" and punished severely. If the "justice" system of a country does not ensure that then it is up to the individuals and the people to change that system by any means they see fit. Revolt and revolution is one way of achieving those. Many of the current democracies (such the US and France) have gone down that path with great success.

Sometimes being a law abiding citizen is the worst crime one can commit. Have you heard of the Nazi Germany? What if all the Germans were being good and law abiding citizens and did what Hitler wanted/expected of them? Could they defend their actions by claiming they were just being good citizens and obeying the law of the land? Would Nazi Germany punish a member of Gestapo for killing or burning a Jew or an opponent of Hitler? I don't think so. Then why would you think the Ayatollahs are going to punish a Basiji or a Pasdar for what they have been taught to do, namely keep this regime in power by torturing, raping, killing and looting the people of Iran.

And I never claimed this particular guy should be lynched or torn apart (even though I believe he deserves it). All I said was in a working systems criminals should be punished. Unfortunately in Iran we won't have a working civil society as long as these beasts are in power.

We are all familiar with those principles, as much as you, but remember we are dealing with a herd of savages that will stop at nothing against the people of Iran.

Dr Hedjazi - thank you for respecting due process of justice ..

I am very grateful to you for stressing the observance of the due process of law.  This procedure has nothing to do with gullibility in the face of the lawlessness of the IR, but has to do with respect for universal human rights and civil responsibilities.  If individuals took the law into their own hands and acted on the basis of emotions rather than observing the principle of 'innocent until proven guilty', society will degenerate into violent chaos and brute force - what we call the law of jungle.  Whatever the IR may or may not do in respect of lawfulness, we are responsible to ourselves and our fellow beings not to follow suit in violence and abuse.  What is the point of challenging a regime if we are no better when it comes to the question of respect for justice and human rights?

I understand the point being made by Mr Parviz and Majid about criminals escaping justice, but the point is not so much the punishment of individuals, but the exposure of crimes and injustice.  If the due process was carried out, that is, if the person was allowed rightful defence and hearing, and then not lawfully punished, he might get away with it, in the short term, BUT the regime that allows such an abuse will be further exposed and alienated from the population which is intently watching  ..

Parviz

Well said my friend, LAW and IRI are like water and oil, they just don't mix, PERIOD

The entire IRI's legitimacy went down the drain in the past month and a half, not that they were doing much better before, but now the gloves are OFF.

The so called supreme leader sold a nation to a worthless roach called A.Nejad.

 So much for a "Leader".........LOL 

Shame    

حکومت قانون?

آره خیلی‌ خوب که بذاریم قانون مسیر خودش رو طی کنه، ولی‌ آیا شما آنقدر ساده هستید که انتظار دارید جمهوری اسلامی ادمکشهای خودش رو که به دستور خودش ادمکشی میکنند مجازات کنه؟
جمهوری اسلامی و حکومت قانون دو مسئله کاملا جدا از هم هستند. این دو نمی‌تواند با هم همزیستی‌ مسالمت آمیز داشته باشند.