For an Islamic Democracy

Your Missing the Point: Extremism has it's advantages ;0)

John Cleese vs Extremism

SP, I mean freethought, first 200 years of your Islam in Iran,we

couldn't even speak persian.

Do whatever you like with your taxonomy and topologies, but don't miss a day of Juan Cole.

Overthrowing IR is just the first step in a very long term process. Our religious culture is a bit more entrenched than you might think.

//iranian.com/main/blog/hooshang-tarreh-g...

Signature reads "for islamic dedmocracy" while the

      text advocates Rajavi cult! You left me confused bro! The anology between MEK and IRA is absurd at best!

       The profile picture you have chosen has an eerie resemblence to Saudi flag while your username is Salman Farsi! Is that an irony or harmony?! Confudsed again! ;-)

I agree why Can't we All Just Get Along ? ... ;0))

Just Like in the Good Ol' Times ... 

Mufti Husseini and Hitler

LOL 

I suggest you read some social science & some history

Of course we had all of that. But civilizations change, transform and adapt, and obviously the Iranian civilization under the Sassanians could no longer adapt to the Sassanian way of life. It chose something else.

Your choice whether you wish to debate or not. But if someone speaks from an uninformed position, there is a duty to set the record straight. Iranian Islamophobes don't seem to understand that they are unwitting pawns to a discourse that can only be called by one thing: Fascism.

In that time the Islamic

In that time the Islamic narrative has informed every aspect of what critical theorists call the lifeworld of that nation. Art, poetry, literature, philosophy, mysticism, architecture, morality and ethics, to name a few, has been informed by this religion.

Like before Islam we had none of that...Iran thrived in every area despite Islam under the cirumstances not because of it. I had enough of your revision of history. 

Don't even bother trying to debate me. I have no use for thinly veiled apologists for Islamic Imperialism of the past nor the future under the mask of "humanism".

چه قصاب خانه ايست اين دنيای بشريت!

Mash_Ghasem

You make vague statements without substance. Give examples of what you mean. Wahhabism, Deobandism and Salafism in one corner, and the Khomeinist VF in the other corner, is what constitutes Islamism. Everyone else in the Muslim world is none of these things. All academic typologies of Islamic Fundamentalism aka Islamism place a given extremist Islamic movement under one or the other rubric. If you are aware of other Islamic Fundamentalisms, please tell us so we can taxonomize them and find out what they're about and put them under the microscope.

Iran has been an Islamic nation for 1400+ years. In that time the Islamic narrative has informed every aspect of what critical theorists call the lifeworld of that nation. Art, poetry, literature, philosophy, mysticism, architecture, morality and ethics, to name a few, has been informed by this religion. Not all of it has been bad. Surely you cannot tell me that the architecture of mosaics in the mosques of Isfahan or Mashhad are violent and un-Iranian! Art historians would laugh at you and call you a know-nothing philistine if you suggested this. These masterpieces were made by believing Muslims.

That this regime is Fascist and that its founder and successors were lying opportunists and thugs is no disendorsement of a Shaykh Baha'i, or a Hafiz, Mowlana, etc. All it says is that Khomeinism is a form of Fascism and that the seminary must be forever separated from the state. That is all.

Last time I checked IR was responsible for much of bad stuff

in my life and the lives of everybody else I know. You forgot to add Mao, Crusaders, the Brits... and don't forget them Mormons, once they get their President in the WhiteHouse , you'll see what's up.

You, 'freethought' is the one that dosen't get it, even with a

new avatar.

It's a lot more than IR and Saudis, they're just tip of the iceberg. Islamic Fundamentalism as an ideology, movement and state is vastly varied, and in a sense as complex as the land they originate from, and it's a bit more than just Iran and Saudi Arabia.

What does all this defense of Islam in an all Iranian context , on an Iranian site, make you?

Mash_Ghasem

Who dropped the Atomic bomb on Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Who committed the Holocaust of WWII? Who dug the killing fields of Cambodia? Who killed 20 million Kulaks in Russia? etc etc etc etc Answer: Non-Muslims.

Freethought: You must a

Freethought: You must a newbie...We have had these discussion many times in the past..I refer you to IC archives...There are hundreds of comments that take your version of what happend to task much better than I ever could. I am not willing to re-visit those arguments because it has been discussed ad nauseum....

نه اون فحشای دیروزتون نه جا نماز آب کشیدن امروزتون

 it is so funny to see many of the yesterday's Islamophobes have changed their colour and become "objective analysts" of today!!

I told you, you guys are not even gutsy enough to stick to your own words.

For an Islamic democracy

vildemose

You and people like you talk about the Arab invasion of Iran as if the Sassanians were passively sitting back unawares of the Arab Islamic armies invading them and were just taken by surprise and victimized by the invasion. The Sassanian empire crumbled because 1) it was exhausted after centuries of internecine warfare with the Byzantine Romans, 2) the Sassanian state was corrupt , 3) the clergy dominated imperial policy, 4) the subjects of the empire were sick and tired of the heavy handedness of their imperial Sassanian masters and 5) religious persecution was rampant throughout the Sassanian state on all levels (even orthodox Zoroastrians were persecuted by the Sassanians). Do not forget what was done to the Manichaeans, the Mazdakis or the Nestorian Christians under the Sassanians.

Now at the battle of Qadisiyah Yazdigird III was actually betrayed by his own generals who were simply too gutless to fight on. Iranians betrayed and sold out their own monarch and their own empire to the Arabs. So you cannot blame Arabs for everything. This is why I say a knowledge of history goes a long way. Unfortunately Fascist thinking (secular or religious) doesn't like complicated thinking. It seeks easy and simplistic answers to complex answers which cannot be answered in easy or simple ways.

Again, there are many different kinds of Islam. Sufis are Muslims and they are not imperialists. Isma'ilis are Muslims and they are not imperialists. Shaykhis are Muslims and they are not imperialists. Akhbari Twelver Shiite Muslims are Muslims and not imperialists. The only kind of religious imperialism from the Islamic world is presently coming from 1) the Saudi Wahhabis and their assorted spawns throughout the Sunni world and 2) the Khomeinist VF establishment of the IRI. These two are the problem, not everyone else. When you lump all Muslims in the same camp as the two above you don't seem to understand that you are actually advocating these two nefarious, extremist institutions to be legitimate. In effect you are legitimizing them and forcing all their potential Muslim enemies into one or the other camp.

Do you get it?

sp:yawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww

sp:yawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwn..

It is not "your" blog. Writing on IC is not right, it's a privilege, which you abuse quite often.

whatever...

For an informed view of things,

The revelation by CNN that Norwegian right wing terrorist Anders Behring Breivik kept a diary in which he obsessed about the dangers of cultural Marxism, multiculturalism, and the “Islamification” of Europe
will remind many Americans of the tactics of our own right wing (only
these themes have been taken up by people much more mainstream in the US
than Breivik is in Norway!) The movement to ban the shariah, the
castigation of a progressive income tax as “Marxist,” the condemnation
of multiculturalism as a threat to Western values, are all themes
commonly heard in the US Tea Party and in the right wing of the Israel
lobbies.

It would be wrong, of course, to suggest that anyone who hits these themes is a terrorist in waiting or supports violence.

But here is the reason for which such rhetoric is dangerous and can easily lead to social violence.

freethought

One needs not to be a spokesman to see how Islam has repeatedly  caused misery for overwhelming majority of Iranian throughout different stages. So for rest of us 74 million Iranian that have been or are experiencing such life, such an existence (and this is a mere macro view of things, no one has appointed me to see such a social reality, but I merely point out to it). As far as the totality of Islamic history and expereince in Iran, I would like to know what is your balance sheet  for: Islamic Inavasion, Safavieh, and Khomeinism. If you happen to have a very negative assesment of all three, than again, that too is very different from 'hate,' but a mere objective historical observation.

May I call you a cousin at least?

You have already engaged me by visting my blog. I am chuffed to bits :)

 For  an Islamic democracy

sp: You're still ignored and will stay that way for good

Consider yourself ignored as I told you yesterday.

p.s. you calling me sister sends shivers down my spine. It makes my stomach turn...please do not engage me...you are a lost cause as I told you before.

Sister vildemose

You speak as if it was yesterday that Islam liberated Iran from the yoke of the Sassanid velayate faghih. Please wake up sister tat was 1400 years ago. Islam is an integral part of our national identity.

 For an Islamic democracy

Do you understand?" crying wolf

according to them IRI is practising islam so is taliban so are the shicks of saood and the rest. what they have in common is being questioned, do you understand!!

Because asghar taraghe says they dont follow islam dose not mean a thing. they entertain the same of your creed. So what facet is promoting peace and tolerance?

FYI, i am not a fan of religionPhobia of any sort.  

 Jews had imposed their

 Jews had imposed their financial and cultural domination

First, this is not the same thing. Second, the Arab/islamic armies did invade Iran. It is a fact. It is not myth. Islamic colonization of Iran took place. It is not a fabricated or exagerration. We were stripped of our organic identity. For the first 1000 years we were sunni until we had to somehow reconcile our loss of identity with fabricating our own version, the Shia. Islam colonized not only our land but our mind and soul.

whey do you overlook the role of Islamic imperialism in how Iranians feel about them?? We hate the "great satan" because of their imperialism. What is difference between Islamic Imperialism and American Imperialism?

IRI is not Islam. IRI = Fascism

Skimming is not a substitute for reading and you should read what I said. I am against the IRI and have a long track record of anti-IRI activism long before the webmaster of this site saw the "light" and changed his tack from pro-IRI operative to anti-IRI activist. That said, there is nothing Islamic about the IRI. The IRI is a Fascist (capital 'F') state using religion as a covenient tool. Period! Khomeini was a liar and opportunist. Period. There was more religiosity and spirituality under the Pahlavi state then this so-called religious state. As far as I am concerned, the founder and present leaders of the IRI serve one master only: the Devil.

Now the fact of the matter is that the Usuli establishment of mujtahids who dominate the scene in Iran are not the only kind of Shi'ite Muslims. There are many other forms as well. All of these other forms are presently being persecuted by this regime. Do you understand?

vildemose

According to Mein Kampf and the antisemitic slurs of the Nazis, the Jews had imposed their financial and cultural domination upon the German Volk, yes.

" Islam has many facets "

Freethought: The Nazi did

Freethought: The Nazi did not like jews because the Jews had invaded and imposed their religion on Germans?? I'll wait for MG to respond...

Dear brother Freethoughts111

You are like a fresh breath of life. May Allah reward you for your great wisdom, deep knowledge, and courageous stand.

Salman

 For an Islamic democracy

Salmam Farsi = 1 Khaen

who has sold himself to IRR/IRI in 21 century and sold his country, his country men and himself to bunch of uncivilized Arabs.  He never learns from his misery.

The hotter the kitchen the better!

 Brother CoP

I don't like cold kitchens :)

For an Islamic democracy

Islam has many facets

The Islamophobic narrative that keeps reducing Islam to a single narrative of violence is ignorant, ahistorical and ultimately Fascist. The Nazis made exactly the same sort of arguments as you are making about Jews.