Time to Stop Playing the Victim Role
Huffington Post / Philip Slater
22-Jan-2009 (31 comments)

You don't get to act like a victim any more. "Poor little Israel" just sounds silly when you're the dominant power in the Middle East. When you've invaded several of your neighbors, bombed and defeated them in combat, occupied their land, and taken their homes away from them, it's time to stop acting oppressed. Yes, Arab states deny your right to exist, threaten to drive you into the sea, and all the rest of their futile, helpless rhetoric. The fact is, you have the upper hand and they don't. You have sophisticated arms and they don't. You have nuclear weapons and they don't. So stop pretending to be pathetic. It doesn't play well in Peoria.

>>>
IRANdokht

A Message to Israel

by IRANdokht on

"...I'm sorry to tell you, Israel, you came on the scene too late. Genocide just doesn't fly any more. I know it isn't fair, you have every right to feel aggrieved about this, but the world's smaller, cowboys are passé, and bullies aren't heroes any more."


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samsam

by Anonymous fish unregistered (not verified) on

are you REALLY wondering? :-)

it was only many hours later that the moderators decided to post my anonymous comment. probably trying to make ME look silly. but it's ok. the truth usually comes late to those who hate. :-)


Pahlevan

extremists on Iranian.com

by Pahlevan on

In real life, every Iranian I know hates IRI and at the same time condemns Israeli atrocities in Gaza. On Iranian.com however, there are Iranians who spew BS supporting IRI and other Iranians whose hate for IRI has turned them blind to Israeli atrocities. You would only see these opinions on cyberspace because they would be too embarrassed to express them in real life.

I would like to remind people who are supporting Israeli atrocities that this conflict, contrary to Israeli propaganda, was actually started by Israel, that makes Israel the aggressor not the victim:

 

And even if we assume that Hamas started throwing rockets first and broke the "ceasefire", Israel would still be the aggressor, because they enforced a blockade on Gaza which by International law is an act of war and in 1967 it was Israel that attacked Arab nations and killed hundreds of thousands of people because they blocked they Suez canal, and Israel cited this law as justification for the attacks. (This question was asked from tzipi livni at NPC and she refused to answer)

Secondly, Hamas's extremists views and tactics are not surprising. You can't imprison a child in a basement and abuse the child for years and expect him to act normal.

 


capt_ayhab

Victim Card = Political Victory

by capt_ayhab on

Quote:

[

“Jewish proponents of the ‘victim’ card are aware not only of its
social effectiveness but of its usefulness as a means of insuring
Jewish solidarity and, hence, survival. If we were forever hated by all
and are doomed to be forever hated by all, then we’d best stick
together and make the best of it...Personally, I have never found this
view of the eternally-hating gentile to have any resemblance with
reality. It seems a myth, pure and simple, and an ugly one at that.

“Is it a good means of social control? Perhaps, but at what cost? It
strips the faith and history of Jew and gentile alike of all but their
months of antagonism. It wallows in evil imagery and postulates a
forever morally superior Jew, victimized by the forever morally
inferior ‘goy’
..I have spent most of my adult life among Hasidic Jews,
almost all of whom were Holocaust survivors, and I’ve heard almost
nothing of the of the relentless harping on victimology and our need to
forever memorialize it...(Victimology) allows Jews to bypass their own
faith and offers the national allegiance of Holocaust/Israel in its
place.]

Rabbi Mayer Schiller, quoted in “Issues of the American Council for Judaism,” Summer 1998.

 

capt_ayhab [-YT]


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Mehdi Mazloom, why do their blow themselves up?

by Mehrnaz (not verified) on

Mehdi, I have no intention to go into the history of the creation of Israel. I expect you as a citizen of Israel to try and find out. Perhaps I can suggest that you read the Iron Wall, by Prof Shlaim, which is no 'radical' account, just to set the basis for understanding that Israel, regardless of the suffering and persecution of Jews in Europe, was founded on racial identity on occupied land, through deceit, manipulation and terrorism. The suffering, insecurity and trauma of Jewish people was exploited to create the state you call Israel.

In relation to the current genocide in Gaza, Hamas had expressed readiness to negotiate with Israel and had kept the ceasefire, even whilst under an inhumane blockade of 1.5 million people, which is itself an act of war. The reason for the attack and slaughter was because of the possibility of peace where Israel would have to reconsider its illegal settlements in the occupied territories. And as you, unfortunately, point out, it was meant to terrorise and to subdue.

You refer to Hezbollah and Hamas and suicide bombers as "rats" (as we witness from Gaza, Palestinians are treated far worse than rats), and you question the humanity of parents who aid their children to become suicide bombers. I ask you a simple question: Why should a parent or a young man or woman, or a young child, want to send their most beloved to death or to die themselves in such unimaginably horrific way????

Is it because they are 'rats'?
Is it because they are 'Muslims' instructed by their religion to be 'violent'?
Is it because they hate Jews?

Have the Arabs in that region they have lived for millennia, cohabiting with Jews, had the tradition of slaughtering themselves to kill Jews?

Why do they do it? Just think about it ...

The reason for Israeli action is in the expressed foundation of Israel; to expel, to annihilate, to terrorise, to subordinate the native population in order to realise the dream of a Jewish state and to expand it to Greater Israel ... and beyond. This is not my fantasy. It is history written by Jewish and Israeli historians, and there are ample quotations and records from the founders of the movement, the ideolouges and the politicians past and present to substantiate this. Racism is central to this project, as is to any colonial project.

"Mr. Shamir, standing atop an ancient West Bank castle, told reporters: ''Anybody who wants to damage this fortress and other fortresses we are establishing will have his head smashed against the boulders and walls.'' "In remarks aimed at Arab rioters, the Prime Minister said: ''We say to them from the heights of this mountain and from the perspective of thousands of years of history that they are like grasshoppers compared to us.''
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940...

“[The Palestinians] are beasts walking on two legs.”—Israeli Prime Minister Menachem Begin, speech to the Knesset, quoted in Amnon Kapeliouk, Begin and the “Beasts,” New Statesman, June 25, 1982.

The list is endless and current and in line with the fundamental policy of Israel. Read some history and think about it.

Israel has holds the chance for peace; it needs to recognise the political and human and civil rights of the Palestinians who are the native inhabitants of the land. It needs to withdraw from the occupied territories, in line with the UN resolutions. It needs to want peace on based on terror but based on the recognition of equality. It needs to break away from acting out a chosen trauma endlessly in pursuit of its racial and expansionist project.

Good luck ..


Niloufar Parsi

israel

by Niloufar Parsi on

is an embarrassment to the jews.


Mehdi Mazloom

Mehrnaz - I will be dumn

by Mehdi Mazloom on

You wrote:

You call the people who have lived on the land you have stolen 'rats' and treat them as such, or worse, and you shed crocodile tears why they
fight you.

Oh boy where do I begin?.

I will tell you what!. I call any mother or a father who wraps 22lb (10kg) explosives around her own 19 year old boy. Encourages him to go look for other teen agers of his own age, and BLOW HIMSELF TO PIECES (Yes, I wish to be very graphic here), killing as many innocent people civilian who go about their daily lives. I call this mother a monster. There is no reason in the world, for any mother (or father) to betray the fundamentals thrust which every child bestows upon his parents for them to betray that trust.

I will call "rats" to Hibollah leaders who invent a non-existing occupation (Israeli of Lebanese land), to manufacture "resistance", and excuse to incite hatred, as Hizbollah is doing these days.

When a religious leader of a community preaches blind hate to innocent young man & woman, and instill death and destruction in their hearts and minds - as sacred deed. calling them "rats" is a compliment.

Nassrallah who has gained more notoriety among the Arabs & Muslims, based on demagoguery and hate of Jews. I do call him and his pack of homicide murders "rats". 

Again ans again, I will remind people like you that, it is not as much about labels, and name calling. Rather, it is the type of mind set under which any given societies are brought up. Their value system, and respect for human life, it the crux of my message. Not lebels.

Just to provide yu with an example.

When a group of Islamist thugs raided Mombai, and murdered 170 innocent people - Jews, Hindus Christian, and yes innocent Muslims too, we didn't hear, nor saw any Muslim clerics utter even a faint protest. Yet, when some stupid cartoon of Muhammad were published by some obscured Danish paper. Muslims were all up in arm, killing more the 100 people.

This type of double standard which create the deep resentment of Muslim from non-Muslims in the street. 


samsam1111

Annony fishi

by samsam1111 on

who do you think is deleting your comment?

a penny for ur thought .


samsam1111

Mehdi , good job dude

by samsam1111 on

don,t let em get away with empty propaganda & dumb rethoric.


anonymous fish

i registered for one reason and one reason only

by anonymous fish on

because it is perfectly clear that the moderators were not going to post my comment.   i will probably not use this registered name again, as is my absolute right.  if you know who i am, bully for you.

my comment was, in it's entirety: (and sorry it's so long)

there is a huge difference being ignorant and being fair. 

i address this to you because your comment is clearly addressed to me and i will not let stand another "assumption" of being accused of addressing an individual versus addressing several "similar" comments.

 

please take a moment and a deep breath and be fair, with me and the situation.  if i am accused of muddying the water, so should you with the reference to mandatory service.  can you not see that?  i ask you in complete seriousness and civility.

 

i can not for the life of me understand where any misunderstanding regarding my stance on this issue comes from.  i have stated as plainly as i possibly can that i am opposed to unnecessary violence.  i have stated without any ambiguity that i am not in absolute support of israel's show of force.  i do not believe that numbers alone determine the pity factor.  i do not support zion as an individual in light of her provocative statements.  i absolutely believe there is a difference between zionism and support for israel and the jews as a people.  i do support israel as a matter of personal opinion in light of many factors, none of which need to be explained to you or anyone else.  i do believe there is a massive anti-semitic faction in the world.  i also believe there is a considerably less but still major faction of anti-semitic feelings on iranian.com. 

 

i have a right to that opinion.  period.

 

some of your statements are contradictory at best and argumentive at worst.  i do not understand your "loyalty / bias" comment.  are you implying that my loyalty to america is biased?  forgive me if i misunderstand you but i simply do not understand the rationale of that statement.  and i beg of you, do not underestimate my determination to be equally fair, as an american and a human being.  i am an american and will never be ashamed to admit or defend my country.  nor should you.  i accept criticism of my country (with some natural defensiveness) because some of it is true.  equally, you should be able to accept criticism of your motherland.  being defensive and abusive because criticism comes from a "foreigner", as you have so often put it, is hypocritical and grossly unfair.  also, it is my opinion (read "opinion") that being "sexually affliated" with an iranian does give me a somewhat more informative opinion.  do not deny that my sexual partner has as much right to comments and opinions as you.  if he elects to share his opinion with me and i second it and YOU don't like that opinion, tough shit.

 

in addition, it is your opinion that my support or loyalty or defense of israel is based on "totally lopsided US media".  you have absolutely no idea why or when or how i formed my loyalties.  NONE.  NADA.  ZIP.  please do not make such assumptions on MY behalf again.

 

if you yourself admit media bias, then let me re-enforce that notion in reverse.  i do not belive everything that the media says or shows.  i wish you would acknowledge the same.

 

if your comment was not directed towards me, then forgive me this long explanation.  but again, i can only hope that you will be fair enough to admit that it did and WHY i believe it to be.

 

to everyone else and as a comment in general, i can only say that those who know me, including spouse and in-laws and friends, know that i have only the best intentions for iran.  it is my hope and dream that i will one day be able to visit your beautiful country. 

 

but i can not and will not consider that i have to agree with any and every thing an iranian says to be considered a member of this community.  nor will i consider for one moment that anybody on iranian.com is the voice of the "world".

 

god bless you, America and Iran.

 

peace to the World.

 


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Mehdi Mazloom re Irandokht

by Mehrnaz (not verified) on

"The fact that, Hizballah did not dare to raise his nose from its underground rat holes and come to the aid of hamas, clearly validates the assumption that that deterrence had worked".

I won't touch the rest of your arguments in reply to Irandokht because the final paragraph sums them up in essence. The essence is profound and blind racism. You call the people who have lived on the land you have stolen 'rats' and treat them as such, or worse, and you shed crocodile tears why they fight you. Perhaps if you could look yourself in the mirror and examined the history of Israel you might recognise something and be able to show some compassion. I believe that might save you from perpetual victimisation.

PS - Israel has lost again, I can see people who supported Israel and believed the propaganda that Hamas and Hezbollah are terrorists, are appalled and have re-examined the long-held views pumped into them by years of propaganda. I have also seen many Jews disgusted, ashamed, and redeemed by joining forces with those who oppose such crimes against humanity.


Mehdi Mazloom

IRANdokht - Khosh-kell khanom

by Mehdi Mazloom on

(hope you are a woman)

Again, lets address your reply point by point.

You wrote:

Honestly, your arguments might sound convincing to you and a few others
who think like you do, but they're not exactly refuting anything
.

reply: convincing?. Israel is my country, I have lived in the areas where those dreaded rockets were landing. You did not. I still have family member live there - You don't. Off course I am biased. Hamas forces people like me to chose between the lives and safety of my family and their's. which one do you think I should chose?.

You wrote:

 surprising because I thought Mr Slater was very clear and to the point...

Reply: POINTS. what the hell do you think I did, challenge and refute with credible evidence many of his points.

Hamas itself does much better job refuting Slater's thesis, far better then I or any Israeli could do.

 

You wrote:

It's amazing how you continue to defend bombing of UN facilities,
killing of innocent children and you refuse to see the "wrong" that was
done by the name of "self-defense". 

Reply: And It IS amazing how you seem to continue to defend sending rockets into Israeli cities and towns,
killing of innocent children and you refuse to see the "wrong" that was
done by Hamas in the name of manufactured "occupation to invent "Resistance ".

You wrote:

Obviously you and I don't see this under the same light, and as you
have previously mentioned you are from Israel and I know they do have a
mandatory service so you probably have even worn the army uniform
there, but I am not from either country, so I don't have any relations
to them to take sides blindly and out of patriotism

I have no doubt if you would have families living in S. Israel where they had to endure 8 years of senseless rocket, afraid to go out, or allow they children play out side w/o fear of being killed by a rocket. You and anyone else in the same position would do the same to stop the rockets.

It is not the physical effect to which those kitchen table rockets were causing. rather the psychological and the fear which Hamas was trying to instill into the residents in those towns and cities, with clear intention of drive them out of their homes and cities.

Hamas took a gamble and hamas lost - big time. They are kaput as a military force.

The ferocity of the Israeli response was to send a clear and unambiguous to hamas, Iran & Hizbollah. We do love life and more then that, the lives of our woman & children. there won't be any  compromise when you target our children.

The fact that, Hizballah did not dare to raise his nose from its underground rat holes and come to the aid of hamas, clearly validates the assumption that that deterrence had worked. 


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IRANdokht

by Anonymous fish (not verified) on

there is a huge difference being ignorant and being fair.

i address this to you because your comment is clearly addressed to me and i will not let stand another "assumption" of being accused of addressing an individual versus addressing several "similar" comments.

please take a moment and a deep breath and be fair, with me and the situation. if i am accused of muddying the water, so should you with the reference to mandatory service. can you not see that? i ask you in complete seriousness and civility.

i can not for the life of me understand where any misunderstanding regarding my stance on this issue comes from. i have stated as plainly as i possibly can that i am opposed to unnecessary violence. i have stated without any ambiguity that i am not in absolute support of israel's show of force. i do not believe that numbers alone determine the pity factor. i do not support zion as an individual in light of her provocative statements. i absolutely believe there is a difference between zionism and support for israel and the jews as a people. i do support israel as a matter of personal opinion in light of many factors, none of which need to be explained to you or anyone else. i do believe there is a massive anti-semitic faction in the world. i also believe there is a considerably less but still major faction of anti-semitic feelings on iranian.com.

i have a right to that opinion. period.

some of your statements are contradictory at best and argumentive at worst. i do not understand your "loyalty / bias" comment. are you implying that my loyalty to america is biased? forgive me if i misunderstand you but i simply do not understand the rationale of that statement. and i beg of you, do not underestimate my determination to be equally fair, as an american and a human being. i am an american and will never be ashamed to admit or defend my country. nor should you. i accept criticism of my country (with some natural defensiveness) because some of it is true. equally, you should be able to accept criticism of your motherland. being defensive and abusive because criticism comes from a "foreigner", as you have so often put it, is hypocritical and grossly unfair. also, it is my opinion (read "opinion") that being "sexually affliated" with an iranian does give me a somewhat more informative opinion. do not deny that my sexual partner has as much right to comments and opinions as you. if he elects to share his opinion with me and i second it and YOU don't like that opinion, tough shit.

in addition, it is your opinion that my support or loyalty or defense of israel is based on "totally lopsided US media". you have absolutely no idea why or when or how i formed my loyalties. NONE. NADA. ZIP. please do not make such assumptions on MY behalf again.

if you yourself admit media bias, then let me re-enforce that notion in reverse. i do not belive everything that the media says or shows. i wish you would acknowledge the same.

if your comment was not directed towards me, then forgive me this long explanation. but again, i can only hope that you will be fair enough to admit that it did and WHY i believe it to be.

to everyone else and as a comment in general, i can only say that those who know me, including spouse and in-laws and friends, know that i have only the best intentions for iran. it is my hope and dream that i will one day be able to visit your beautiful country.

but i can not and will not consider that i have to agree with any and every thing an iranian says to be considered a member of this community. nor will i consider for one moment that anybody on iranian.com is the voice of the "world".

god bless you, America and Iran.

peace to the World.


Hajminator

The good reference ain't dog

by Hajminator on

but monster.


Criminals who kill innocents and then laugh at people who were been massacred are not animals, but monsters. That's a first proof of being racist (Monsters are basically racists).

Yes, Iradokht aziz that's very unfotunate to meet such things at this forum, and also to see that some are fooled. Thanks for the article.

Khaleh Moosheh, noiZ, is a continual wez-wez. But it's good to be their for us to be aware that if we let such wez-wez succeed, more pushy ones will be the nightware of our children .

Kaveh Nouraee

Cynthia McKinney???!!!!

by Kaveh Nouraee on

I can't stop laughing!!! This is Cynthia McKinney:

The Congresswoman who repeatedly cried racism (and still does);

Who was an advocate of dictator Robert Mugabe of Zimbabwe.

Who repeatedly refused to wear her pin signifying her as a duly elected member of Congress for security and identification purposes when entering the Capitol building;  

Who physically assaulted a U.S. Capitol Police Officer in an incident related to the aforementioned refusal to wear her member's pin;

Who publicly implied Al Gore (remember him? He invented the Internet) is a racist by saying he had a low "Negro Tolerance Level";

Who used taxpayer money (set aside for the purchase of congressional office supplies) to buy an airline ticket for composer Isaac Hayes to fly to Atlanta for the dedication of a new office;

Who was fined by the Federal Election Commission for receiving illegal and unlawfully excessive campaign contributions in 2002;

Who used an old videotaped endorsement by Andrew Young in that same 2002 election campaign, and when asked about it, her father Bill McKinney, a Georgia politician himself, said the age or the validity of that alleged endorsement didn't matter, because "Jews have bought everybody. Jews." Then for added effect, he spelled it out.  

"J-E-W-S.".

Who introduced a bill called the MLK Records Act, designed to unseal and declassify documents surrounding the 1968 assassination of Dr. King. Also included in the wording of this bill was McKinley's requirement to declassify documents surrounding not only the 9/11 terrorist attacks, but also the 1996 murder of rapper Tupac Shakur in Las Vegas.

Oh yeah, Cynthia McKinney is credible.

If ignorance is bliss, then sweetheart, you must be in complete unadulterated rapture!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZoOHBtku4U&feature=related


khaleh mosheh

High pitched

by khaleh mosheh on

Its this shrill noiZ again---have to reach for my ear plugs.


Zion

Great Job Mehdi

by Zion on

A complete point by point debunking of this disgusting nonsense. Way to go!


Kaveh Nouraee

Anon Fish

by Kaveh Nouraee on

Yes, there's a mandatory general conscription of 18 months, but it was reduced by 1-2 months last fall in some cases. If you're still attending school, there's an exemption.


IRANdokht

Dear Friends

by IRANdokht on

I really don't know why it is so hard to communicate these facts with certain people. Some have loyalty to their own countries and ok I guess I can understand their bias, but some are just influenced by the totally lopsided US media and unwilling to open their eyes and their mind to the actual facts that other countries in the world are able to witness.

Cynthia McKinney had a very scary experience in the Mediterranean sea just after Christmas and their humanitarian aids boat was rammed by the Israeli force. She was speaking on the Pacifica radio's "beneath the surface" last night. The account of what she, the other few volunteers and the three doctors who were in the boat went through was horrifying. She revealed the role that the media is playing in hiding the truth by bringing up an example of the CNN reporter on the spot.

As she also mentioned the American people have been kept in the dark by the mainstream media, but the information is there and available for people who are interested to know the whole story. Some are happier if they don't! I guess it must be true what they say... ignorance is bliss!

She spoke right there after the attack: http://digg.com/politics/Cynthia_McKinney_SLAMS_Israeli_Navy

IRANdokht


IRANdokht

LOL Niloufar jan

by IRANdokht on

Don't tell anyone ;-)

IRANdokht


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It is time to stop playing victim

by Mehrnaz (not verified) on

Thank you, excellent article. Israel is accusing Hamas of inflicting those horrifying injuries on the population of Gaza!!! 'We are good, civilised and victimised by these evil savage Arabs who kill their own children with experimental weapons'!!! As for the charges of anti-Semitism, I have found it illuminating that Haaretz publishes outright anti-Semitic and offensive ignorant comments, but does not publish comments opposing those anti-Semitic remarks if they come from someone expressly opposed to Zionism and explaining the danger of this racist hatred!!! Also praising the work of someone like Gideon Levy and Amira Hass, if it comes in the context of elaborating how their work challenges the stereotyping of Jews in Israel and in that way challenges anti-Semitism, does not get coverage! In fact, my comments are routinely blocked by Haaretz and all of them have always been strongly opposing attacks on Israeli civilians and anti-Semitism ... Yes, it is time to stop playing victims and allow the victims of Holocaust to rest in peace, it is time for Israeli state to wash off the blood from its hands and make peace with its neighbours. It is time to show humanity and humility to the natives of the stolen and occupied lands and live side by side in real democracy and equality.

All those cries of rockets from Hamas... Why is Hamas fighting? What is Hamas fighting? It is time to stop and ask that question instead of playing victim. It is time to feel some shame and concern. That way, there WILL be peace.


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please don't

by Anonymous fish (not verified) on

flatter yourself.

i don't think i was the one who made references to "dogs". if you think that's muddying the water, so be it.

i stand by my comments 100%.

would any other iranian please let me know if iran has or had mandatory military service or not?


Niloufar Parsi

Irandokht jaan

by Niloufar Parsi on

great article! thanks.

btw, you actually log on at work?! :)


Hajminator

Déjà Vu

by Hajminator on

I don’t know who’s the most racist? One who says that slaughtered children are war porn or one who condemn criminals perpetuating these massacres?

7000 rockets killed unfortunately 400 Israelis people in 10 years and for each rocket launched an innocent were killed during these 10 years in Palestine.

If Hamas is a criminal group, why Israel created it?

One has to have his whiskers in his eyes and be blind to not see these atrocities.


IRANdokht

Anonymous fish

by IRANdokht on

way to go trying to muddy the water to score a point! nobody said Israelis are dogs (but you)

if you would please ask your husband to explain this to you:

dar massal monaghesheh nist

kind regards (and frankly a little annoyed of being stalked)

IRANdokht


Kaveh Nouraee

Mehdi Mazloom

by Kaveh Nouraee on

I just wanted to give you an online "high five".

Some people think Hamas and the Palestinian people are the same and deny the things Hamas does, like booby-trapping schools, as you mentioned.


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thank you Mazloom

by Anonymous fish (not verified) on

for another clarification on what i see to be a anti-semitic agenda.

irregardless of the non-reply to specific corrections, the truth WILL be known. i've said it time and time again, i don't support ANY violence. but i absolutely do not support a one-sided argument.

facts ARE facts. and you have provided many. don't take this to mean i think israel is blameless, i do not. i'm not even saying i think in terms of percentages of who is righter or wronger. i am simply opposed to a specific agenda of bias that is seen on iranian.com.

the "refusing to see wrong" is nothing more than a refusal to see the unjust blanket condemnation of israel.

although i am quite sure this was NOT the intention, the implication that YOUR children/people are "dogs" is simply unacceptable. israel responded to attacks via rockets. i am quite sure palestine was not aiming for animals but for human beings. again, the insinuation that israels are not human beings but dogs is disgusting. i hope this is clarified with the strongest language possible.

just curious. did iran have mandatory military service? is that reference relative to the issue?


Hajminator

Without victimization,

by Hajminator on

It would be hard to get free riding. That's well known.


IRANdokht

Mehdi Mazloom

by IRANdokht on

I suggest you read Slater's blog one more time and maybe without bias this time.

Honestly, your arguments might sound convincing to you and a few others who think like you do, but they're not exactly refuting anything. It just shows that you didn't get what he was saying which is surprising because I thought Mr Slater was very clear and to the point...

It's amazing how you continue to defend bombing of UN facilities, killing of innocent children and you refuse to see the "wrong" that was done by the name of "self-defense".

You don't go to your neighbor's house and kill his kids because you thought one of the parents might have thrown rocks at your dog! That's not self-defense!

Obviously you and I don't see this under the same light, and as you have previously mentioned you are from Israel and I know they do have a mandatory service so you probably have even worn the army uniform there, but I am not from either country, so I don't have any relations to them to take sides blindly and out of patriotism.

My stance is human rights aspect of what's going on.

I wish I had more time to go into details, but I am at work. Catch ya later!

IRANdokht


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The Peace process was the

by sickofiri (not verified) on

The Peace process was the real IDF target get in there, hit hard, use phosphorus on civilians. Keep the media out. Time it just right: do it while W. is still brain-dead in the oval office; give Obama a whole bunch of riled-up arabs to deal with.

I support Israel's right to exist/self-defense, but this level of violence and ruthlessness is insane IMO


Mehdi Mazloom

IRANdokht - A closer examination.

by Mehdi Mazloom on

I went through the article wriiten by P. Slater. Lets look at some his thesis and address them.

Slater wrote: Title

A Message to Israel: Time to Stop Playing the Victim Role

 

 Reply:  One would assume that, 8 years of constant barrage, and 7000 rockets launched from gaza onto Israel, terrorizing more then 750,000 Israeli civilians are not enough for Slater. Enough is enough.

Would any ohter sovereign nation tolarate such crime against it civilians. You tell me mr. Smart.

Slater writes:

Yes, Arab states deny your right to exist, threaten to drive you into
the sea, and all the rest of their futile, helpless rhetoric. The fact
is, you have the upper hand and they don't.

Reply: Gee Israel!!, just because you had managed to defend yourself and "had the upper hand" against your neighbors declared and avowed goal of obliterating your existence from the face of the earth, then you are guilty.

Slater Writes:

Calling Hamas the 'aggressor' is undignified

Reply: But Hamas's own charter from which few excerpts are posted are "digified - Islamist's own style. READ ON!!!!

"Israel will exist and will continue to exist
until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it." (The
Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed
memory).

"The Islamic Resistance Movement believes that
the land of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf consecrated for future Muslim generations until Judgement Day. It, or any part
of it, should not be squandered: it, or any part of it, should not be given up. "

"There is no solution for the Palestinian
question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain
endeavors."

"After Palestine, the Zionists aspire to expand
from the Nile to the Euphrates. When they will have digested the region they overtook, they will aspire to further
expansion, and so on. Their plan is embodied in the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion", and their present conduct is the
best proof of what we are saying."

 

"The
Day of Judgement will not come about until Muslims fight the Jews
(killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The
stones and trees will say O Muslims, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind
me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree,  would not do that
because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and
Muslim).

(Sourc:http://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/hamas.asp)

 

P. Slater wrote:

And please, Israel, try to restrain yourself from using that ridiculous
argument, borrowed again from Bush (how low can you get?), that Hamas
leaders "hide among civilians", by living in their own homes.

Reply: What this guy won't tell you that, prior to the ground incursion into Gaza, Hamas leaders told their fighters to change their outfits into civilians and mingle among the crowds.

IDF did warn their military leaders they are military targets. Stay away from their homes and families. Also, these hamas morons were using the basements of their own homes and Mosques as ammunition and other explosive depots.

Finally that tops them all.

PS wrote:

Yesterday you shelled three UN-run schools, killing several dozen
children and adults, despite the fact that the UN had given you the
precise coordinates of all its schools in Gaza.

Reply: Why don't you watch this video, which vividly shows how Hamas had booby trapped their own schools. I guess UN didn't have the precise GPS on the explosives. WATCH. Pictures don't lie.