Current Events

Have it my

way? Opening a Burger King franchise :-)

On a serious note yes I do think there are many IC posters saying LK. And sticking Javaldooz into Iranians while taking no risk.

HAve it Your way

Ok Dr. VPK

Whatever you say my good man. I do realize that there indeed some LK(lengesh kon) bunch among us, But i really did not see anything in terms of you Calling anyone's bluff. You expressed your rage against those calling iranians this or that and then it was off to,,, Hey if you wanna go and do this i will finance it!!!

Anyways. You are entitled to see the world and IC commenters any whichever you choose to see...

Iraj Khan

I am with you for most part on opposing these actions. But I don't think it will lead to war. If America wants war they will cook up a reason. If not they will not go no matter what. Sanctions like this will only lead to more Iranian civilian deaths. That is all. On the other hand they do weaken the regime in preparation for war. In other words the sanctions are not the "cause" of war.

They are a prelude to war. 

DM don't put words in my mouth

I am calling their bluff and that is all. Not one of them is going to go back. We have a ton of people here saying "lengesh kon"; "Iranians are cowards"; "they should pay". While living in relative comfort of the West. 

How about even a simpler solution. Why don't the super patriotic Iranian-Americans enlist? Go to Afghanistan and fight? That is being a good American. They will be part of the most powerful military. get trained; armed and paid; and patriotic.

Yes I am calling their bluff. You know "ye soozan be khodet bezan; ye javaldooz be digaran". These guys are sticking a javaldooz to others while taking no risk. That's all! And sorry you ain't getting no money or ticket you ain't no fighter :-)

The main question here is who is benefiting from this sanction?

Obviously it's not the Iranian consumers who will suffer from this one.

Victims will be those who go back and forth between Iran and other countries including Iranians who go back to visit their friends and families.

Similarities are obvious between what they are doing to Iran and what has happened in Iraq where people get blown up on a daily basis.

Sanctions such as this will lead to war, and war means destruction of Iran as we know it. 

VPK

Seems like you are provoking people to replace doing something totally crazy and bad by pushing them to do something equally maniacal and Brutal with you offering to provide all the financing.

Also. WHat is with this "The long term result.." line... Seems to me you need to go back and take a look and edit the sentence?

What gives brother? WHat are you saying?

P.S, Not a fighter here... But would you send me the check... a blank one preferrably... Khnaoom bache goshnan...

:)))

ما برای آزادی قدس شریف

هر نوع سختی را تحمل میکنیم.

شرکت هواپیمایی برای چه میخواهیم؟ 

مرگ بر آمریکا

مرگ بر اسرائیل

زنده باد حزب‌الله لبنان.

Logic vs Anger

If you read Amirparviz you see a logical argument. Some others supporting the "sanctions" are just showing their anger. The facts are that USA does nothing to really weaken IRI. But all the right theatrics to make AIPAC happy.

Plus as one poster Arj said IATA is supposed to be an international organization. But it follows US directions like a good dog. The long term results will be to form real independent international organizations. Those which are not  puppets of anyone.

Meanwhile the usual crowd is going around bashing Iranians. Oh we are stupid; we are horrible. I make an offer right here. Any of you who want to go back and fight IRI. I will pay for your ticket. I mean it. Post your offer here and I will get the ticket to you.

Peculiar!

The most curious aspect of such sanctions is their compliance with the unilateral U.S.-imposed embargo as oppsoed to UN-sponsord sanctions, as IATA is an international body rather than American! Nonetheless, the onus remains on the IRI officials and their irresponsible attitude towards sanctions in the first place!

Congratulation, Iranian are the dumbest people in the universe

Or should I say smartest, we revolute against old regime because we wanted to go backward and we are just doing that, from having the best to having not even the worth.

What can I say when majority of people believe in a stupid religion and Akhoonds as their leaders. Congratulation again for job well done.  

This act clearly shows us the USA still loves Hezbollahi Party

for Iran.  This does nothing to weaken or bring about regime change on Hezbollahi Party ruining Iranians lives.

It just causes hardship to Iranians not Hezbollahi Party.

Again, it is quite simple

First of all, I am not blindly supporting anything, and not advocating this act at all.  I am just saying it is not surprising.  We cannot pretend that the continued trajectory of death to America on one hand and IRGC tigtening control of every aspect of Iranian society on the other hand will have no effect on Iranian citizens. 

Now before you lecture me,  I hope you are smart enough to realize that it is not about IRGC  obtaining money it does not need through ticket sales for a loss making airline.  It is about the use of an airline to provide logistical support for IRGC, which is worth much more than any ticket revenues.   I have already viewed it through an Iranian passenger's perspective- it is better in any case to take a foreign airline, because this regime has destroyed the Iranian one.  Well before today's announcement by IATA.

Re:It is quite simple

 Fair:  

Not sure I am following your point at all.

AFP:

...............................

IATA said Monday it had suspended the processing of Iran Air ticket
payments because of the US sanctions, which target financial
transactions by specific Iranian organisations including Iran Air.

"The
ramifications of not complying with this would have wider effects on
the industry," a Geneva-based spokesman for the association, Chris
Goater, told AFP.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

So if you follow your own reasoning here in defence of this act, if the intent is to stop financial transactions of IRGC, how would processing of Iranian passangers tickets make a dent here?    I hope you are smart enough to realize, the best way to transfer money in support of terror would not be through transfer of money using airline tickets?!, where every security agency in the world is monitoring it.   Rather than blindly supporting and defending a non-sensical U.S policy in this case (forcing IATA to impose this on Iran Air)  try to view it from an Iranian passangers perspective, who has to jump through many extra hoops.  For what?

It is quite simple...

IATA is not the USA, but IATA facilitates the integration and streamlining of airline transactions between each other and with passengers worldwide.  For this, the airline needs to be integrated into and have access to the global financial system.  Iran Air was placed under sanctions by the US government for supporting operations by the IRGC. 

Nobody is saying this will cause regime change, and I am not happy about this either, of course normal Iranians will suffer.  But the blame is fully on the regime, not the US nor IATA.  Iran Air is a state owned airline used and hijacked by the regime as it pleases, and if the US identifies Iran Air as providing logistic support to the regime's terrorist IRGC, then the US is fully within its rights to slap sanctions on it, and if that means that a payment cannot go to Iran Air through any US bank, that means IATA cannot assume integration of Iran Air in the global financial system.  Expect more of this to happen as more and more of Iran's economy is taken over by the IRGC.  If the regime wants these sanctions lifted and they are so bad, they should get off their high horse and follow a policy of rapprochment with the US.  But that would be the end of the mullahs, because then who would they blame for their total incompetence and stupidity in ruling Iran.

Like I said, unfortunately we can expect more and more of this type of sanction as IRGC expands its control over the economy of Iran, and continues to exercise direct military terrorist rule over Iran.  We cannot pretend like these things should have no effect or consequences, and tha that ordinary Iranians will not pay.  This is no joke.

In the meantime, Iranians who want to travel to other countries will have to now use other airlines, as they have been doing already.  IranAir has not been a viable airline, even well before IATA took this step.  Sad fate for an airline that was at the forefront of civil aviation before donkeys took over the country.

HOMA

aside from the old fleets and many shortages ;have they been paying their membership fees?

Can it enter IATA under a new name(not shams-ol emareh) with a fake certificate? 

Iranian peoples need less hassles from the many ones they already have .

Maziar

I Do Pity The Ignorant!

The ban by Western Europeans started in 2010 for safety reasons. That is nothing new. More countries have followed suit. With or without IATA's ban there haven't been and will not be any change in IR's policies with regards to Iran Air's safety measures. They had more than three decades to do something and they didn't do anything. Having to rely on Iran Air is an unfortunate problem some Iranians have to deal with. Being mistreated is nothing new, either. Ask around! Those who fly have the wherewithal to do so. They are the ones who are feeling the pinch. And they don't necessarily put the blame on IATA! It's usually some west-residing disillusioned folks who can't think beyond their own travel plans that keep blaming the rest of world for what IR is doing wrong!

Not for those who knowingly want to hurt Iranian people

but those who simply don't know or are misinformed:

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

A: What is IATA? (according to their own mission statement:)

//www.iata.org/about/Pages/mission.aspx

Our mission (IATA)

Today, IATA's mission is to represent, lead and serve the airline industry. Its members comprise some 230 airlines
- the world's leading passenger and cargo airlines among them -
representing 93 percent of scheduled international air traffic.

....

• For consumers, IATA simplifies the travel and
  shipping processes, while keeping costs down. Passengers can make one
  telephone call to reserve a ticket, pay in one currency and then use the
  ticket on several airlines in several countries.
• IATA allows airlines to operate safely, securely, efficiently and economically under clearly defined rules.
• IATA serves as an intermediary between airlines and passenger as well as cargo agents via neutrally applied agency service standards and centralized financial systems.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
So this is an organization that allows *easy* ans seamless transfer of tickets and other convinences for passanger along with enforcing safety standards.  How does not being part of this will help regime change in Iran for the Einsteins on this board?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

What is the implication for Iranian passengers?

As I stated, many of Iranian officials travel with their own private Jet.  For instance, Ahmadi Nejad took his own jet to U.S, and his flight was arranged so they could refuel with no problem for him.

But for Iranian, unfortunately those over on this side, some are very clueless.   There are thousands of Iranians travelling to nearby countries like U.A.E/Qatar/Malaysia ..... on a daily basis, and a good portion of it is done using Iran Air, to conduct business, work etc.  By kicking Iran out of IATA it seems to me the biggest problem will be for Iranian passangers trying to reroute tickets or get other services at the airports, and be treated like 4th class citizens.  (They are already not doing so well).  Not to mention more relaxed safety measures.

Now may be some genius over at I.C really think this will cause a regime change in Iran.   Or perhaps, the objection here is why U.S is not supplying spare parts. No, no one is asking for spare part from U.S   that is not the issue.  The Islamic Regime has been looking for ways to get rid of Iran Air to stop all ailine subsidies.   Islamic Regime has no issue with turning Iran further into isolation, as long as their top terror agents, who got blacklisted are now delisted for travel, after being named government officials.

By not being part of IATA, we lose a big regulatory entity, and Islamic Regime would love nothing better than using this as the reason behind more incidents, and of course travel convenience for Iranian people have never been their top priority.

So hate the regime all you want, you are not alone, but don't take it on your fellow Iranians.   This measure will only hurt the interest of Iranian peole.

G Rahmanian

As usual you got me. No I do not care at all. I bow to your superior intelligence and knowledge. Now are you happy; you managed to get your say. Maybe I am a team of people thought of that!

My comments only seem contradictory because I do not hold a well defined political view. I am not a "right winger" or a "leftist". I am not pro or anti Israel. I neither hate or love NIAC. These make my comments appear contradictory. 

Aynak:

Get over it. One reason(There were other reasons.)I stopped reacting to your comments last time was you lied and I pity people who lie when it comes to important issues. And when I pity people I can't bring myself down to their level to have arguments with them(My criticism of those who support the regime is a different story.) You're still so upset you can't think clearly anymore. You take things so personally, I doubt you actually care for Iran or Iranians at all. As for your comment on this thread I ask, what do Iranians do, when flying out of the countries where Iran Air doesn't provide any services? Don't they go back and visit their relatives? You're like VPK with a little bit of more knowledge of things which you have a hard time putting to good use because of your personal issues. Knowledge does not necessarily mean logic. It helps one's logic. Have you ever had the time to think why people have different views on the same issues? And getting back at people or "winning" should be the last thing on your mind when having an intelligent debate.

Responses

Fanoos: I am getting tired of this silly discussion. There is no single cause. There are multiple causes alright? My response to Disenchanted was somewhat tounge in cheek. However Israel does have a hand in the mess. By the way your jab at the name of Disenchanted is a jab. Not worthy. Nor is the silly "chiken or egg". I am done explaining it to you. If you need more information go find it on the tens of sites available.

Fair: the USA does not have to sell anyone parts. But IATA is not USA. They have international obligations and must hold them. Do you see the difference or not?

VPK:

The Problem Is when some individuals who don't give a damn about Iranians pretend to be upset! VPK: I don't believe you really care at all about anyone's safety or well-being. You only want to roam around this site and pick a fight with someone, anyone! As you like to say, don't read what you don't like. You have made lots of contradictory comments and don't even realize it. As I said, stick to the topic at hand. Don't try to impress others by spamming every thread and arguing with anyone who says something simply because it does not match your way of thinking. My spamming on Shazde's thread yesterday was to show you how ugly spamming can look. But your response was, "G. Rahmanian, you talk too much." You see, you have difficulty understanding things. And as long as you keep spamming without thinking, you will miss a lot of what is said and meant. Maybe you don't care, but don't address and attack people in your comments and expect nicities in return.

Dear SAK, Thank you! If only some of the NIACies had a sack of

marbles to criticize the IRR rather than harping on MEK, AIPAC, Bush, Cheney, etc.

As Fair just very eloquently stated no one is to blame except IRR and their criminal supporters!

Looking forward to reading your book on, "The Benefits of the 2x2-leggeds." 

Stop blaming IATA

for air safety problems in Iran.  Every country is responsible for its own transportation safety.  In Iran, the islamic republic cares more about women's dress, people's satellite dishes and styles than the lives of ordinary citizens.  Look at all the air crashes in Iran and all the casualties- which kind of planes were they in?  THEY WERE RUSSIAN PLANES.  NOT SUBJECT TO ANY SANCTIONS.  Is that IATA's fault?  or the west's?  Or is it so hard for you to accept that IRI mismanages Iran's civil aviation just as badly as it does its banks and its economy and its citizens' daily lives?  How about ground transportation?  Iran has one of the highest, if not the highest road fatalities per capita in the world.  Is that also because of western sanction?  Or is it because mullahs don't put 1/100 of the effort they put into policing women's hair and people's bedrooms  on policing Iranian roads? Or they have not put a high speed and expanded rail network throuhgout the country?  Should America come and do that for us?  Or IATA?

Before this islamic government existed we had the fastest growing and one of the best airlines in the world, perfect safety record with the latest and greatest equipment.  That was decades before Emirates.  Our parents chose to stick islam in place and follow a donkey back to the 7th century, and along that path came death to America.  These things have consequences, we have paid the price since, and are paying the price now.  

The United States is under NO OBLIGATION to sell anyone anything.  If the IRI truly believes and follows a policy of death to America, then it should not be surprising at all that Iran will not benefit from American goods and services if America so chooses.  That is IRI's choice, not that of the Iranian people or America.  And therein lies 100% of the blame.

Like SAK said, va salam aleikom va barakatoh.

VPK! I was fine with your two hypothesis of chicken vs egg...

two hypothesis of chicken vs egg argument that is whether West is the main cause of the Iranian people predicament or they themselves!

Next you know, this disappointed poster jumps in and introduces a third variable into the equation as the cause i.e., Israel and you conveniently jump in on his band wagon!

Please tell me which one of the following came first the rooster, the hen, or the egg?

Thank you!

VPK

I hope that day will come soon (khoda as dahanet beshnofeh), or a supreme being thereof.

I still have family and friends in Iran, and if they have to go from Tabriz to Bandar Abbas (or whatever the names are nowadays) in a hurry, they have no choice but to hop on IranAir and I will cry for them.

Responses

• Dear MM: who will cry for the fallen? It will be their families. Not the gang on IC or the IRI. One day Iran will be free no thanks to the self righteous right wingers on IC.
• Dear iamfine: Thank you for your very kind words. I am an ordinary person who does not want to see my fellow Iranians suffer. That is all.
• Fanoos: you are pretending to not understand. I already posted the link to 32 thousand Basiji. Would you like to go back and confront them? I will pay for your ticket. 

Faramarz

I do not support NIAC 100%, but my criticism goes directly to NIAC.  One example is oil sanction/strike which I have pointed as a key to dry up IRI's money to pay her thugs. 

However, as you pointed out, NIAC does a lot of good too, but the proponderance of BS on IC towards NIAC has no boundries, so I see a need to point out where people are just talking deceitful or are just jealous.  An example is is DK (not Kadivar) in Trita's interview which claimed that Trita did the following:

"I remember not too long ago he was denying any human abuse in IRI, he would refuse to even admit if there was any abuse in IRI......he is loyal to Velayet Motlaghe Faghih (Ali Khamenie)"

MM

I took your comment, "This is sad - now they are playing with Iranian civilian's lives" as if it was directed at the West. If the comment was directed at the Regime and not at the West and the International Organizations, then I apologize and stand corrected.

Mehrdad Jaan

Mehrdad Jaan,

I am not necessarily anti-NIAC. I support their social activities like Camp Ayandeh for the kids, the recent field trip to the Congress or their lobbying on the multiple-entry students' visa. Although I have to admit that I do not support having Hamed Haddadi, an accused physical abuser near children at Camp Ayandeh (Haddadi vs. Golnaz "Asal" Karbalaei-nemat-moeeney. The assault charges against her were dismissed. The charges against him are still pending and he has left the US and has not been back.)

Let me also say that I do not consider you a NIAC person since you criticize them as you see inconsistencies and as you should.

My problem is with the people who put NIAC and Trita on a pedestal and take their Yazdi handkerchief out and say that we should either get in line behind them or else.  I have a problem with his soft approach to the Regime. I do not have any evidence that Trita is on anyone’s payroll and I attribute his insistence on meeting the IR officials to his naïveté. I believe that he is completely clueless about the brutal nature of the Regime in Iran and is pushing an agenda that he does not fully comprehend. 

Anahid/Faramarz - who will cry for the fallen?

Since Faramarz's comment was directed at me, I would like to challenge where I have blamed the west.

I have blamed IRI for incompetence, among other adjetives, but if the west does not sell Iran new planes and parts, we get >30 year old planes in the hands of folks who told us that they did not need educated people and "he" would bring a few talabeh(s) to take our place.

As a result, IRI bought Topolov planes who my friend said is made for cold regions, and now in the hands of irresponsible and incompetent. My point was that if IranAir is prohibited to fly internationally, they will not stop flying inside Iran and "who will cry for the fallen". and I bet you it is not IRI.