A disturbing trend; request for civility

Veiled Prophet of Khorasan
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan

Recently I have seen a very disturbing trend on IC. People are getting more nasty towards one another. A major reason has been the debate on MKO. However it goes beyond that.

Recently I have been personally attacked by several bloggers. One used such words {in Persian} that were very inappropriate; someone else flagged it and the post was removed. I was basically "ordered to leave the blog". While I had done nothing that would warrant it. The language used made a chill run down my spine since I have not heard Iranians use that sort of language towards one another in years. What is going on and where is all this hate coming from? 

Others accuse each other of libel; being agents of various nefarious agencies. I would like to make an appeal for civility. We are here to exchange ideas. We do not own blogs they are owned by IC and are here for exchange of ideas. To learn from each other not to simply agree and pad each other on the back.


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by Mammad on

Thank you.


Veiled Prophet of Khorasan


by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on


Just for the record I apologize for any attack I made against you. While I disagree with many of your positions you are reasonable. 



by Truthseeker9 on




by Truthseeker9 on


Veiled Prophet of Khorasan

Example of a personal attack

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on


Here is an example of an unwarranted attack on a blogger. If you are interested you may read the blog for youself and decide what you think. 

I cut and pasted this from this blog:


Where did you get your law degree? Hoze Elmieh Ghom?

Anyone with least common sense can tell you are an Islamic regime sympathizer. So you think in U.S no Iranian should be tried for any crime just because they are Iranians and work for the interest of the Islamic Regime? Smuggling goods and opium might be okay for the members of the Sepahe Pasdaran under the Isalmic Sharia and in Iran but it's not okay here.


Veiled Prophet of Khorasan


by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on


No problem I find talking to you just as difficult. We obviously do not connect. But I will not insult you or accuse you of anything. Just that I find communicating with you difficult. That is life. 

Veiled Prophet of Khorasan


by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on


You may arrive to any conclusion you want: it is your right. It does not change the fact I did not attack any person. MEK is the most controversial group on IC. I am yet to see anyone admit to being a supporter or member much less a representative. That makes it impossible to even have a debate with them.

On the other hand people openly admit being of other groups. That proves the other groups be it Greens; Monarchist; Communist; Israeli; JM; Muslims or Bahai all have proud members. People who are not afraid to admit their association. Sometimes they get attacked; sometimes defended.

The problem is no one admits to being a part of MEK. This business with "I am not a part of them but defend their right" is not helping them. Because how do I ask important questions from a person who does not represent MEK? How about if MEK would send an official representative to IC. Not just a supporter but one empowered to respond to questions. There are plenty of them roaming the congress so getting one to IC should not be hard.

Anahid Hojjati

Dear Truthseeker, thanks for your comment

by Anahid Hojjati on

I agree with you about the animal welfare blogs. I did see those and some people's comments were mean.


Sorry VPK

by Truthseeker9 on

but this just shows why some people find talking to you frustrating. You deny and are happy to place all the blame for trouble elsewhere. On well ...

Veiled Prophet of Khorasan


by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on


  • Dear Anahid: thank you for your kind words.
  • Dear Rea: thank you also
  • Truthseeker: If you notice I did not mention any names as MEK supporters .in the post you quoted.  That was not an accident. I deliberately did not want to make any personal attacks. The only names mentioned are the people I am talking to and I did not accuse either one of being a MEK supporter or agent. So how did I accuse anyone? I do stand by my statement and if you were to show me a direct accusation it would be different. On the contrary one person simply *assumed* I was talking about her then went off and accused me of libel. Hence I was the one being accused. In fact that person was not even on my mind when I made the original post. 


dear Anahid

by Truthseeker9 on

I read those blogs and I came to another conclusion, that those supporting the RIGHTS of a certain Group are not supporters of their ideology but supporters of Democratic rights for that Group. I find this type of labelling childish and unproductive. It led to a lot of trouble and it was all unnecessary.  I also understand where people like Esfand are coming from. Although I did not agree with his/her language I can see his/her frustration. Sometimes some people try to dominate blogs with their views and repeat and repeat the same thing to have the last word. This can become a source of irritation to other posters in the discussion. Another example is when some Atheist blogs and Animal Welfare blogs were written, and some unnecessary bolshy behaviour was going on to disrupt these blogs. Sorry Anahid, but it is not a clear case of one person being an angel here and others the villain. Everyone needs to realise that other peoples contribution is important, not to just see things from ones own perspective. I hope the blogger also uses this opportunity to reflect on his words and actions too.

areyo barzan

Dear VPK

by areyo barzan on

I completely agree with you. We all need to learn more about tolerance and respect.

We do not need to agree with each other or even like each other, but if as a nation we want to survive and prosper and if we are serious about wanting democracy we need to learn to respect and tolerate.


However, the funny thing a bout tolerance is that one normally tolerates what one dislikes the most and one does that to uphold a grater principal and to me personally that is what makes MKO so important.


To be honest, personally I despise everything about this organisation its ideology and leaders. Furthermore I believe its followers are either brainwashed or rubbed of all choice because of the long time they have been a member. But as long as they are willing to respect my right to disagree I am willing to respect their democratic rights to campaign for vote.


At the end of the day we have all something to learn from this posting. This is not about finger pointing or accusation but about improving our attitudes especially mine.


As a old poem by the Nineteenth Century Professor Rabbi Israel Salanter says

 When I was a young man, I wanted to change the world.I found it was difficult to change the world, so I tried to change my nation. When I found I couldn't change the nation, I began to focus on my town. I couldn't change the town and as an older man, I tried to change my family. Now, as an old man, I realize the only thing I can change is myself, and suddenly I realize that if long ago I had changed myself, I could have made an impact on my family. My family and I could have made an impact on our town.

Their impact could have changed the nation and I could indeed have changed the world.”


I guess we can all learn a thing or two from this especially me

Anahid Hojjati

Dear truthseeker, the quote that you have from VPK

by Anahid Hojjati on

only shows that he called some people supporters of MKO. I don't blame him. Weeks ago, when delisting discussion started, talk was about how all groups should be involved in fight for democracy for Iran. Later it turned into an unconditional support of MEK by couple commentators. I don't want to name names since he is not on this thread but one writer/commentatotr is now defending almost all actions of MEK and has an answer for whatever people say about MEK. I call such a person supporter of MEK even if they don't announce it. So in my opinion, VPK was not writing anything bad and he was justified in the comments that you just quoted from him.


Don't take it seriously, VPK

by Rea on

It's just virtual. In real life they'd probably have a glass of wine with you and merrily discuss different points of view.

PS. if of any consolation, in my country forums we are still fighting ww2. And from there to the 90s war, we are well set into 2025 insults.


RE: Civility

by Truthseeker9 on

Dear VPK, been reading your blog and comments and just want to remind you that what you preach applies to you too. Lets not make villains of your detractors, they are just as human as you are.  Many times it is you who starts to stir up the trouble. Someone else showed you these links before.

dear Mehrdad by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Fri Aug 19, 2011 08:19 PM PDT You are right this is a waste of time; but it had one major benefit. We now know exactly who MKO supporters on IC are. Who to trust and who not to. This was a very useful thing just for that one single reason: we know them.

VPK shame on you!by Mehrban on Fri Aug 19, 2011 08:24 PM PDTFor branding people for expressing their opinion.  It is likes of you who have closed the doors to open discussions in Iranian politics.  Shame on you!

Mehrabanby Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Fri Aug 19, 2011 08:35 PM PDTI have nothing to be ashamed about. Shame belongs to those who support the traitor MEK not me. I stand by my words and if you don't like them then don't! No one is closing discussion on anything.How did I "close" the discussion? I don't run IC and I don't ban people. However I have a right to my opinion. I do not support criminals and murderers. If that is your idea of shutting down discussion then so be it.


Don't take things too seriously, cause

by Cost-of-Progress on

the call for civility doesn't take you very far.

Fact is that this is an internet forum that allows people of all creeds (even Iranians) to spill their guts anonymously. In fact it shows the very problem our culture and society has and why after over 4000 years of histyory we are where we are today. We cannot - will not - unite if our lives depened on it, and that, is our major flaw! 

You are a passionate contributor and I can tell you have a lot of love for your ancestral land. Don't let uncivilized "discussions" take the wind out of your sails.  We Iranians are all political experts. Just look at our country!!






by amirkabear4u on

you are saying this.

VPK, you are one of those people who sometimes make comments too then why are are you complaining??????

Fairness and Equality in Justice


How about writing a blog and calling EVERYONE names?!

by Disenchanted on


         We all complain about how bad you feel that people call each other names. But how about writing a blog and call everyone in the community a name: Terrorist, Basiji, IRI agent, Nationalist, Marxist!

         It just happened two days ago. It is still on the site. We all know who wrote it! Funny thing is some of the folks on this thread were cheer-leading the blogger!

         The fellow named his despicable act an act of BRAVARY while others praised him for his FUNNY blog! 

          We can't ban people for expressing their views no matter how stupid. But we can express our disagreement and disgust with such tactics!

          JJ is an intelligent editor. He refrained from publishing that blog on the main page. Later he went on to comment on the blog and shame the author and others for what he called the practice of SAVAK and SAVAMA!

          Other members have commented on this blog along this line. This kind of blatant name calling and sowing seeds of hatred and degenerating the healthy discourse has to be condemned by everyone.


Soosan what is really going on today is discussed here

by amirparvizforsecularmonarchy on

Its real documents and real policies by real powerful people and yes for control of oil flow, ie to prevent china/india getting any and to prevent the oil rich countries from developing.




"I have been called everything"

by Roozbeh_Gilani on

mammad, you think that is bad? Go to Fred's blog and look at the names they call him: Jew boy, zionist, mossad agent, etc and these are the polite ones!

VPK, I am sorry about your experience. I saw the blog at my lunch break, I noticed the tempers were being raised. I felt like saying something, but as I was commenting myself, I thought it could make the matters worse. Also I noticed that faramarz was trying to calm the situation. I think at times like this it's best to let go and walk away from it. Remember, behind all these words lay an arrray of transistors generating 1,0,1,1... patterns converted to real Electrical voltages and currents driving your monitor.  nothing more, nothing less..... 

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."


Agree with Mamad.

by BoosBoos on

You protest only when you are attacked?

by Mammad on 


Mamad, the standards have to be uniform - I completely agree with you.    The thought also occurred to me.  For example if you are going to allow user names that permit the names of people's religious figures to be combined with the word "toilet," you better be willing to do that for all faiths or not at all.  One aspect of this site that has become especially ugly is the bigotry towards ordinary Muslims -- objecting to the GOVERNMENT in IRAN and to a RELIGIOUS GOVERNMENT is not the same thing as attacking a person because of his or her faith.  The latter is a universally recognized form of discrimination.   And unfortunately, it has been allowed to flourish here under the pretext of discussing government policies in Iran.  

I'm sure someone will come along and now call me a "Basij" for pointing out that human rights include freedom from religious discrimination.

But I agree Mamad.  You're right.  They're wrong.  It's that simple.  


You protest only when you are attacked?

by Mammad on

People like me have been savagely attacked ever since I have been commenting here. I have been called everything: Islamist - a racist word that I despise - is the most "polite" of them. IRI agent, nuc lobyyist,  Haji, Dr. Strangelove, Khomeini lover, fraud, bore.....Lies, innuendoes, and insinuations have been used, and baseless accusations have been constantly made against me, all by people who hide behind bogus names, while those of you who know my identity know that I am a public person and highly visible.

Most, if not all of you, were silent, never said a word in protest. Many of the commentators that now say "I agree with you VPK" not only did not say a word of protest, but also directly or indirectly supported the attacks. Some even enjoy them by applauding them and acting as cheerleaders for others. And why? Because I am a practicing Muslim, have never ever hidden my belief, and have opinions that differ from yours. So, while I agree that civility is necessary, it has to be applied uniformly to EVERYONE, not just those with whom we agree.

Mostafa Tajzadeh,


the outspoken reformist and one of the most patriotic men that I know - and a man who has never been accused of any crime - who has been in jail since right after the 2009 election said, "If we had protested what happened during the 1980s - the executions, the repression, what was done to Grand Ayatollah Hossein Ali Montazeri, Grand Ayatollah Kazem Shariatmadari...., we would not have been in the situation that we are now."


And in the movie "The American President" Michael Douglas said, "defend the right of the person to set the American flag on fire as part of the right to free speech, then criticize and protest the action" (gharib-e beh mazmoon).

So, paraphrasing two great guys, I say, "If we had protested what some do against the large majority who want to have a civilized debate - no matter how "hot" it may be - we would not have been here," and, "defend the rights of others to express their opinion, and then criticize what he/she says without labeling him/her, making baseless accusations, and using innuendoes and insinuation. Disagreeing with someone is our right. Insulting, labeling, attacking him/her just because he/she does not see things the way we do is not."

And, do it before the insults, attacks, innuendoes, insinuations, etc., have happened to you.


Soosan Khanoom


by Soosan Khanoom on

Since March there have been many horrible things going on in Lybia which western media choose to not show  ... Media is selective ...

It has been said that  if you drill into the heart of any western imposed  War you reach OIL .... 

they have already started the drilling over there and have invited the French and italians over .... 

Soosan Khanoom


by Soosan Khanoom on

I understand your frustration and i admire your honest feedback on various topics especially on MEK..... 

I am also so tired of name callings here especially calling someone an IRI agent.....

There are millions of people over there who voted Ahmadinejad or there are many who for example cry when Khameni talks. They are people of Iran too. We can argue that they are wrong and we can argue that they are uninformed or brainwashed but we can not say that they are all IRI agents. They are IRI supporters but not agents.  There are also many IRI supports in the west as well. Although, I should say at least those who are living in the west should be less uniformed or brainwashed and if they are not  then they are just hypocrites, still that does not qualify them to be an agent. 


Soosan Khanoom

VPK jan

by Soosan Khanoom on

"I Know What You Did Last Summer" is title of movie that made a fortune at the box office .....

 since then everyone is using it in their humors ....

otherwise, I do not even know what I ,myself, did yesterday yet alone to remember what someone else had done last summer .. lol


What a world, I choose to be here!

by amirparvizforsecularmonarchy on

As we are going back and forth, I just looked at the news and it was horrible, with rebels and loyalists killing each other so some cause wins and someone benefits, I definetly like the digital craddle of democracy concept.

I'm going to make some chai be back in a few.

Veiled Prophet of Khorasan


by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on


How is it that every topic on IC ends up with Faramarz and his dating adventures ?

That is a very good question. I was wondering about it myself.


I DON'T want to know what he or anyeone did last summer. 



by yolanda on

OMG! What a funny exchange here!

Thank you, SK!

Soosan Khanoom


by Soosan Khanoom on

How is it that every topic on IC ends up with Faramarz and his dating adventures ?  

Look who is all over the map now.   Faramarz, I am watching,  I know what you did last summer ...

: )

Oon Yaroo

The top 10 nicest people on IC ever! VPK is #5!

by Oon Yaroo on

How do you like them apples, VPK?

BTW, Faramarz, in case the hot chick you find happens to know yeh Yaroo deegeh (female) send her towards me!

Much obliged!