Jahanshah Javid

Yes, Esfand jan I am here

and personally, i am looking forward to changes like ease of posting, etc.

.

I am not sure how trust is coming into this.  I see it more as a reflection on some blogger's intolerance or weakness.

Having bloggers options clearly stated  makes for better informed choices for commentators.  I hate  surprises of this sort.

I have really stated what I wanted, and I conclude my posts to this blog.

Anahid jaan are you new here?!

Do you not know the Iranians on this website?!  Have you ever seen anyone honor someone else's request?  Quite the contrary, they'll dig in their heels and scream to heavens that  aaayyyyy neighbors come and see!  Oyyyyy ayahonnaas come and see what is going on here!  Oh mother o Mary Ann Joseph!

Everything is sacred

Spontaneous order?

Or, why is Anarchism getting the short shrift (as usuall in here)? Could it be that we have this incredibly authoritarian culture, ingrained for centuries and centuries? Or we just don't like spontaneous stuff? Or...

Any who: amongst the thousand and one definitions that there are for Anarchism, one of the most approperiate ones is the one below:

ANARCHY AS SPONTANEOUS ORDER:

Spontaneous order, also known as "self-organization",
is the spontaneous emergence of order out of seeming chaos. It is a
process found in physical, biological, and social networks, as well as
economics, though the term "self-organization" is more often used for
physical and biological processes, while "spontaneous order" is
typically used to describe the emergence of various kinds of social
orders from a combination of self-interested individuals who are not intentionally trying to create order through planning

//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_order

what if..

we had this scenario. let's assume someone comments on x's blog. x might be happy to engage in further dialogue with the commentator which in that case, everything is ok. if x does not wish to engage in any further comment exchange on that blog with that particular commentator, they can request the next comment of that commentator be his/her last at any point in the exchange. commentator can write his last comment in which he either is satisfied with comment exchange or if he/she has more points to discuss, he can insert a link to a blog that he has written to address his points. this has the benefit of giving visibility to bloggers who refuse to engage in comments habitually and also those who repeatedly get the message that blogger does not want any more of their comments. also people are encouraged to come up with more content rather than just commenting.

Bambi the world will not come to an end if we don't "comment"!

So don't comment if you know your comments may be deleted.  Others may choose to comment knowing they might get deleted.

Just because "some people like to use the delete button when losing a debate" doesn't mean others will do the same.  Besides it is that person's right to delete a comment or comments if s/he thinks s/he is losing the debate.  What makes your right anymore justified than his/her's?  How do you know YOU are not the one losing the debate?

This comes down to whom do you trust?  No really who do you trust and what makes you think whomever you trust should be trusted by me? 

Everything is sacred

sharing my youtube experience

I don't like my comments being controlled by random bloggers for shear disagreements, so if I know my comments are being subjected to being deleted prior to or after publishing,  I will probably never post on their channel again.  The reason is the issue of control and respect.  Even if I totally agreed with or liked their content, I just won't make comments. 

Esfand, I get your points, but on the other hand, there are some people, who like to use the delete button when losing a debate.

VPK's comments seem most sensible and offer more solutions.

I like the HG suggestions

By all means please implement them I support them 100%.

The new format will turn IC into chat rooms with invitation only. Unless JJ keeps the option of "no user moderation" so some chat rooms are open. 

As for blocking users it makes no difference. Once you have censorship power you might as well go all the way. Your credibility hits 0 then why not; sure in fact have them totally block a user. I would welcome being blocked on some blogs. One thing if they block me but talk about me I demand the admin to remove those posts. No one has a right to talk about me without letting me respond. 

The best exchanges I have had included people like Amirparviz; Siavash; Tabarzin; Rea; and many others. They did not turn into insults. On the other hand there have been insult fests with some which might as well not have happened.

PS: Faramarz Jan I got several pets. Fish are useless and incompatible with cats other than for dinner.

I also suggest an area of i.com dedicated to attacks!

Perhaps a place like the devil's stone during Hajj where pilgrims go and throw stones at the stone!  A place where we can throw insults and accusations, attack and ridicule at will!  IRI oh IRI! 

Everything is sacred

My Suggestions

I honestly believe that some people on this site really need to get a pet, a cat, a dog, a parrot or even a gold fish to talk to and spend less time on the site saying things that most people have no interest in reading.

A good way to determine if you are abusing the free speech right is to count the number of your comments in a given day and see if you are way above the average. Also by now most people know where different people stand on different topics so re-hashing the old stuff is totally useless. And if someone doesn't want you on his blog, have the self respect and stay away. It is like asking somebody out and she says no.

Finally, a sense of humor is always appreciated!

Bloggers should b allowd2 block a user from their blog al2gether

In addition to Comment Control I think bloggers should be allowed to block a user altogether from that blog.  For couple of reasons; 1) so that they don't have to go and delete after delete the same user if s/he insists on pissing contests and 2) so that when the blogger goes to sleep the pissing contestants won't have an opportunity to use the dark of night to continue with their mayhem! 

Everything is sacred

suggestions/question

couple of suggestions on the new format: 1. list usernames whose comments were censored from a blog/article/news piece on that particular blog/article/news piece page. this way one can readily distringuish the level of tolerance of each contributing user.  no need for explanation on why the contributing user censors the comment. 2. limit votes/likes 1 per ip address to avoid multiple voting by the same user through multiple ids.  otherwise, it will not be the democratic process of 1 person/1 vote as the site might want to portray.

question: will cuss words and personal insults be tolerated in the new format by the site's administrator(s)?  i can easily see the site degenerate if the shah-abaadi language (fohsh khaar madar in tehran ghadimi slang) becomes commonplace.

Two kind of blogs

I already answered Bambi's question. Have two kinds of blogs: user moderated; open. That should satisfy both sides. Once you make an open blog it may not be turned to user moderated or vice versa.

Bambi how do you suggest Pissing Contestants be treated?

We are not talking about "honest exhanges".  We're talking about people who have nothing better to do than to go on people's blogs and irk the author by saying whatever they want.

They can go on a Monarchist blog and become anti-Monarchy or go on an MEK blog and become an IRI idealogue and so on and so forth.  They don't necessarily use profanity.

So how do you suggest they should be treated?  BTW please be mindful that not "trusting" the people is what has screwed up everything and spun many dictatorships around the world.  Here you are not "trusting" the people to use good "judgement" when you give them comment control. 

Everything is sacred

Dear JJ

Already we have groups of people voluntarily segragating into subgroups. For example after a mass of insults I decided not to go on some blogs. Now it will be official. So probably not much will change in that sense.

One thing would be nice is to have a the user "moderation" be optional. The blog indicate whether it is "user moderated" or not. Then we know which blogs reflect the "approved" opinion of the owner. And which ones are open to general public.

Otherwise the assumption would be that all blogs are opinions of the owner. Meaning none has any credibility. Because I get to delete anything I do not like. Anyway I made my opinion clear and it is your site so it is your business.

poor idea

At the risk of sounding redundant, I have to say that the blogger controlled comment  inherently makes a bias towards comments that agree with the blogger's views.  It is a poor idea and does not encourage a balanced exchange.  I've already seen it on youtube, and it essentially never reflects the viewers true opinions.  It feels like being a guest at someone's home and having to go by their rules.  It won't encourage honest exchanges.   The only plus is that more (sensitive) people might be willing to blog, but at what cost?

I'm thrilled

Thank you all for you input.

I can't wait for the new changes. iranian.com needs better, friendlier tools to enable users to express themselves in more ways, faster and in a safer, healthier environment. When you come to iranian.com it will be up to date, with new posts every second, not every 24 hours.

We will employ some of the best tools from Facebook and Twitter without trying to copy them. Users will have lively pages where they can post a variety of content from blogs, to poetry, to photo essays, to music, to news and share them with everybody or the people they care about.

The front page will feature content from everybody, and the ones that get the most "likes" or "votes" will be more prominent.

Today's mass media is just that -- run by the masses, not editors. More than ever, iranian.com will be a reflection of YOUR wishes and views, not mine or anyone else's.

Mehrban jaan water will not be moved from water!

Everything is sacred

Dictatorship vs rule of law

Without getting too much into the above topic.  The new set up sounds more like Anarchy to me and now that our only anarchist blogger (Nur? Tabarzin?) has been banned ;).

Indeed it will be an interesting experiment. 

Getting too personal is THE reason to have comment control.

When someone wants to get personal with you when you don't want to, what do you do?  Whatever your answer may be, it is not one size fits all. 

I have a handful of jackasses (one hand ;-) who despite their claims come to my blogs, especially if it becomes a popular blog, and try to "sell" themselves as goody two-shoes!  

i.com has more than 10,000 registered users yet many shy away because of the petty ways people here act AND the website in the first place that allows it and leaves you no way out.

Now if you LOVE these pissing contests that is another story!  Yes i.com is THE place to be for pissing contests!  But don't you worry the pissing contestants will remain and you can have as much of it as you want on their blogs! 

Everything is sacred

Dear Rastin

That is probably what is going to happen. What are your favorite other forums? 

Why so serious?

There's multiple of Iranian forums around, why not move to one of them if you are that unhappy about the advertised changes? Just let us know where you end up!

Parsis Victor

Jesus ... er Allah ... I can see this coming ...

MY ORWELLIAN NIGHTMARE: Flagging Abuse based on Political Correctness is Not Fair

Pendar Neek, Goftar Neek, Kerdareh Neek !

THE STORY OF GOD: Robert Winston explains Zoroastrianism

If I may ... While it lasts ...

SC@$W You All ! ...

LOL

Best

DK

PS: Thank you for your hard work nevertheless ...

Basically JJ is caving

in to one particular person with way too much influence. If you want to ban me I don't care because IC will be dead soon anyway. This person has already shown his abusive nature towards me before. I don't post on his blogs.

A while ago there was a poll and this idea lost big time. Now under the guise of server and memory we get this? What an incredibly poor excuse. Get more servers. Or divide based on content say one server for politics one for news and so on.

But to see a whole site give in like this sickens me. One promise: I will never again donate to IC. It might as well become the Tehrangeles right wing club. This is truly a shameful act. One last suggestion: make comment control optional and indicated on the blog. It should show if it is a "author controlled" blog. That way I will simply avoid blogs by those who turn on comment control. I have no interest in talking to such people anyway. Makes it possible to know who is tolerant and who is not. 

HG is right

will one dictator be replaced by many?  will some people censor others opinion just because they don't agee with it? 

Yes that is exactly what will happen. Already we see natural self imposed divisions. I do not post on blogs by at least two users whose names I will not mention. Then it will become a rule enforced by the little dictators.

In my opinion it may end most discussions on IC. Why not put up my own chat room with my buddies if I want to control the content. Why bother going to IC. Might as well use my VPK facebook page.

In short this is a giant step backwards. Make IC a place for tiny people with tiny minds. Which have no room for opposition. We got plenty of them now. What you will get is more of them; fewer who want real debate. A real victory for the dictators.

Why not have one IC

..... for each of the groups? IC shaholahis, IC republicans, IC reformists, IC IRIs, IC socialists/communists, so on & so forth. And a wee bit for IC foreign residents. ;o)

@hamsade g., by asking: "will one dictator be replaced by many?", you've nailed it.

Brilliant comment by HG

"let's see how you guys will behave if you have control.  will one dictator be replaced by many?  will some people censor others opinion just because they don't agee with it?  will the censored people make their own blogs just to respond to unfair censorship?"

Also, love the comment by Pendar Nik, very funny and to the point.  

Personally, I think JJ has caved in to requests by his long standing members for more control. To give this level of control to bloggers, when we see how personal people get on this site does not seem logical to me. I thought whole point of discussion is to have people with varying views in the debate, and it may get heated. On the plus side perhaps it reduces workload for Admin.

the change

what and when ever it may be;good for all...

 But please dont take tht FISH from the IC's logo thanks.

Maziar

Apples and Oranges.

I think you are mixing apples and oranges.  We have one dictator controlling ALL content on i.com.  With comment control we have control over our content ONLY.  There is a difference.

In response to all your other questions, well each individual will act differently as it should be.  Right now we have no other choice.  It is the Auntie's sour yogurt soup, whether we like it or not!

BTW by death to dictator I didn't mean death to Admin, I meant death to dictatorship.  In this case I should have said, death to dictatorship, sorry about that.   

Everything is sacred

I think JJ is on an Iranian clock with his promised changes

"dorost misheh inshallah" is what appears to be the plan.  He has been talking about it for more than a year now, and now he's promising change in a few months.  How long does it take to revamp a website?!! Come on JJ-- put aisde the "chai" and the afternoon nap and get to work.  You can do this in a week if you put your mind into it. :-)