Current Events

Al-moghan'e!

by salman farsi on Sun Jun 19, 2011 02:56 PM PDT

The alternative story is (attested by the same historians!) that the real VPK:

• was blind in one eye and his face was eo badly scratched that people were scared to look at him hence wearing the mask
• he used sorcery and deception to make people believe his moon hence thining he was a profet!!
• he was delusional and thought of himself as God

the last character I am sure is genetically passed on to you :))

 For an Islamic democracy

Nazi

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sun Jun 19, 2011 01:23 PM PDT

 

were very through in their killings. They kept meticulous records; and went so far as to remove even gold fillings from their victims teeth. The Safavids were not so sophisticated. They just cut off your head.

That is why they got so much more done than the Nazi. Just send a bunch of thugs to chop people's heads off. That is a lot more efficient than the Nazi who had all that "red" tape.

This Salman won't

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sun Jun 19, 2011 01:06 PM PDT

give up on this bs will he.

At least the well I had really worked! The miracle known as "Mahe Nakhshab" is well kown and attested to by historians. If someone could show me Mehdi coming out of a well I will be impressed.

But there is no Mehdi coming out of a well. Mokanna was a scientist well beyond his time. Mollahs are idiots well behind their time. I put my lot in with my namesake. Who was so handsome none could behold his radiance!

One mistake in Salman's link. Mokanna's head was never send to the Khalif. His body was thoroughly consumed by the fire of the oven and none of him was left to be seen. Or sent to anyone until his reappearance on IC :-)

"Well", enough said.

A few replies:

by salman farsi on Sun Jun 19, 2011 02:44 PM PDT

 

Roozbeh:

Thanks for the engineering insight. But to put thing in perspective please remembr that the Nazi killing machine which was the most advanced in its own day (and since) only managed to kill (gas) up to 6000 a day inmates in the death camps of Auschwitz-Birkenau. Safavid, according to Ravandi, must have been more advanced than the Nazis!

VPK:

Funny you should tal about "well". I am sure this is a place where the veiled prophet of Khorassan a had peculiar attachment to! 

Ghasem:

do you see any parallels in these historical cases:

Toodeh party's alliance with the Soviets in Azerbaijan crisis: treason

Toodeh party's ditching Mossadegh in 28 Mordad: treason

Toodeh party's alliance with Khomeini in 1979: treason

our future with the IRI and Toodeh apologist like you: say no more!

 For an Islamic democracy

Thanks Salman,

by Roozbeh_Gilani on Sun Jun 19, 2011 11:09 AM PDT

I'll certainly read the links you provided. My theory is actually parallel/serial, something like: 20,000/100

VPK gerami, I think that Islam is and shall remain a very potent political force in entire ME for at least a few generations to come. We need to learn how to deal with it. We need to debate it with it's supporters. I was reading a few nights ago, and the person who most strongly opposed the execution of political prisoners in 1988 and paid a very high price for it was ayatollah montazari. It was certainly not Mousavi. Montazeri actually named the three men in charge of this shameful crime in his memoire. And did you know that his son was killed by MKO and most of the executed prisoners were MKO members?

The person behind MG and  Hoshang is without doubt one of the best  informed bloggers on this site. I have the highest respect for him.  I'd say this even if I disagreed with his political stance.  

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

Do you see any parallel processing in these historical events:

by Mash Ghasem on Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:32 AM PDT

Islamic/Arabic Invasion: A blood bath.

Safavieh Dynastey: A blood bath.

Islamic Republic of Iran: A blood bath.

2008 'elections': A blood bath.

Our future with IR and apologists like you: fill in the blank.

 

 

 

My dear namesake

by salman farsi on Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:36 AM PDT

or should I say, my dear former namesake, as my original name was indeed Roozbeh!

 

My critique of Mash Ghasem was about his (and a few others') denial of Ferdousi's Shiism. Safavids and their Shiist campaign was a separate issue.  They believed that they had a divine mission to forcefully convert Iranians (yes including the Kurds) to the Shi'a sect. And they had significant successes in their mission but not in the exaggerated manner MG is quoting from Ravandi. The rise of the Safavid was a consequence of rise of the Sufic orders after the Mongol invasion and the collapse of the Abbassid dynasty which gave rise to the Shi'a's gaining power, Their Sufic order had digressed from the maistream Iranian gnosis and so not a proper one. Savaid, despite their brutality can be considered as a powerful and constructive dynasty who opened Iran to the Western trade and diplomacy.

I suggest you study the article in this link if you have time - quite a long one.

//irandabir.ir/forum/printthread.php?tid=539

 

ps - I am keen to hear your Parallel Processing Solution to 20,000 head chops :)

 For an Islamic democracy

Roozbeh Jan

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:10 AM PDT

 

You are wasting time with Salman. There is no point arguing with someone as him. Of course people were killed in parallel. Heck how did Mongols make hills out of people's heads? 

Remember these guys think there is an Imam in a well. If that is their point of view do you think logic will do any good. No it will not work with them. They think Ali loved Iranians and Ferdowsi was a Shia. Right and I have a bridge in Brooklyn.

 

salman: on head chopping statistics MG produced,

by Roozbeh_Gilani on Sun Jun 19, 2011 08:59 AM PDT

 Having read you doubting the 20,000 number, based on how long it takes to, me the engineer, could not help but think that any process can be executed in parallel as well as serial!

But heads besides, I was hoping to hear you say or provide a link or two as to the reasons why under safavieh we became officially a shia nation , and as such, virtual kafirs to majority sunni muslims, including some of our very own compatriots in Kurdestan and baloochestan..... 

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

This is why Ravandi is so discredited

by salman farsi on Sun Jun 19, 2011 07:56 AM PDT

 

"According to "Social History of Iran" by Morteza Ravandi (Vol,8), only in one night in Tabriz alone, Safavieh beheaded some 20,000 people who refused to convert to Shia. " 

Let's see: in one night 20,000 were beheaded in Tabriz. Let us assume the chop chop operation began at 8 PM the day before and lasted till morning prayers at 6 AM the next day. 10 hours in total. That means that 2000 heads were chopped every hour, which means roughly 33 heads every minute which means about one head every 2 seconds!!!

Safavid must be credited with founding "Kaar Khaneh Maashin Saazi Tabriz" LOOOOL.

 

 For an Islamic democracy

To say 'Safavieh' tried hard to push Shia in Iran, is like

by Mash Ghasem on Sun Jun 19, 2011 07:08 AM PDT

saying Asghar Ghatel had a healthy, innocent  'predilection' towards children.

According to "Social History of Iran" by Morteza Ravandi (Vol,8), only in one night in Tabriz alone, Safavieh beheaded some 20,000 people who refused to convert to Shia. This was only one instance. Bloody violence has always been the key to Isalm, and Shia domination in Iran.

Shiafication of Iran by Safavieh and its long term, large scale, strategical distortion of culture and politics in Iran is long overlooked and under studied, cheers

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 

حكومت ولايت وقيح و دولت امام زمان و مذهب شيعه  ساخته آخوندهاست - چون در قرآن اسمي از مذهب شيعه برده نشده است و
پيامبر اسلام هم مذهب شيعه را نداشت و در زمان انها اصلا مذهب شيعه نبود
آخوند ها مذهب شيعه و مراجع تقليد و مقلد درست كرده اند و به اسم به خورد
مردم داده اند

المقنع

salman farsi
Sun Jun 19, 2011 07:19 AM PDT

I suppose you are commenting on Shahnameh from a scholarly point of view? If so, source please?

 For an Islamic democracy

Dear Shazde

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sun Jun 19, 2011 03:02 AM PDT

 

We all know that Safavid tried hard to push Shia on Iran. They obviously added their own "addition" to Shahnameh. However it is obvious from the writing it does not live up to Ferdowsi. For one thing it uses too much Arabic.

"Ahle beite nabi" does not sound exactly Ferdowsi to me. Any idiot could write a facsimile and try to push it as Ferdowsi. But it shows.

These great Safavids meanwhile kept cannibals to "punish" their enemies. They were true examples of real face of Shia Islam. //www.iranica.com/articles/safavids

بازم پرت و پلا گفتی‌ اسدلله :)

salman farsi
Sun Jun 19, 2011 05:47 AM PDT

"if anyone has ever read the book...."

 

Clearly Asdola you are not one lol. You are so busy with your bathroom stories that never had time to read the great book in earnest.

Ferdousi had a great love for Islam and more particularly for his own Shi'a sect. On more than three occasions he has admitted to his adherence to the Shi'a sect and at least on one instance he has admonished the Iranians for not seeing the truth from the Arab's point of view.

All you say are cock and bull stories. Bring a single credible evidence or apologize to Ferdousi. 

 For an Islamic democracy

Ya right - Ferdowsi was Shiite ... just like me!

by Shazde Asdola Mirza on Sat Jun 18, 2011 03:39 PM PDT

The appendix part of Shahnameh, where Ferdowsi supposedly attacks (Hajve) the King Mahmoud, is all lies and fabrications by the Safavid copy writters.

If anyone has ever read the book, they would know that Ferdowsi hated the Arab cultural element so greatly that even calling him a Muslim would be seriously tongue-in-cheek!

Salman

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sat Jun 18, 2011 07:24 AM PDT

 

I am tired of wasting time with children; go grow up. Then maybe in 20 years I would bother with you.

المقنع

salman farsi
Sat Jun 18, 2011 06:46 AM PDT

It is obvious that you haven't even read Shahnameh cove to cover (same a you quantom mechanics theories)  if only once. otherwise you wouldn't insult Ferdousi's faith. See the evidence (if you can understand it):

 

ایا شاه محمود کشور گشای ز کس گر نترسی بترس از خدای

مرا غمز کردند کان بد سخن به مهر نبی و علی شد کُهن

منم بنده ی هر دو تا رستخیز اگر شه کند پیکرم ریز ریز

من از مهر این هر دو شه نگذرم اگر تیغ شه بگذرد بر سرم

منم بنده ی اهل بیت نبی ستاینده ی خاک پای وصی

گرت زین بد آید گناه من است؟ چنین است و این رسم و راه من است

بدین زاده ام هم بدین بگذرم چنان دان که خاک پی حیدرم

ابا دیگران مرمرا کار نیست بدین در مرا جای گفتار نیست

اگر شاه محمود از این بگذرد مــر او را به یک جو نسنجد خرد

Now let's hear from our revisionists in residence: Mash Hooshang, and yes our own very divaneh!! LOL

 For an Islamic democracy

Ferdowsi

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sat Jun 18, 2011 06:15 AM PDT

 

There is no way to tell what his religious bellefs were. He is long gone and not here to tell. But in Muslims nations people had to pretend to follow the rules or be murdered.

Just like all the Iranians in IR who pretend to be Muslism. As soon as they get out of Iran they ditch Islam. Why is it that most Iranians outside Iran do not practice Islam. That is some 5-9 million people.

اومدی درستش کنی‌ خراب ترش کردی

salman farsi
Sat Jun 18, 2011 06:09 AM PDT

 حالا ما به همون شیعی گریش اکتفا کردیم ولی تو سه تا پسوند دیگه هم بهش آویزون کردی. حقا که فقط به درد باغبونی باغ دایجان می‌خوری :))

 For an Islamic democracy

Why is Salman Nazi so simple minded and obtuse when it comes to

by Mash Ghasem on Sat Jun 18, 2011 05:54 AM PDT

Ferdowsi, or for that matter anything else? Because he's paid to propaganda on behest of "Islamic" supriority. As far as complexities of Ferdowsi see below:

" Some have simply called him a “Shiʿite” (Yāḡmāʾī, pp. 23, 28); others,
such as Bahār (p. 149), have raised the question of whether Ferdowsī was
an adherent of Zaydī Shiʿism, Ismaiʿli Shiʿism, or Twelver Shiʿism."

//www.iranica.com/articles/ferdowsi-i

 

کنکاشی در دین فردوسی
//www.amordad.net/forum/index.php?topic=10147.0

 

المقنع

salman farsi
Sat Jun 18, 2011 05:44 AM PDT

Did  you know your "greatest" poet was not only a staunch Muslim but also a very stauch Shiite. His name? Ferdousi lol

 For an Islamic democracy

Salman

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Fri Jun 17, 2011 04:59 PM PDT

 

Do what? I am just explaining history to you who proudly use the name of a traitor and criminal. 

Am I making up Cyrus or the names of Iranian months? Am I inventing NowRuz from DC? Or did I create the Sassanids. I assure you I did not write Shahnameh or create the legend of Rostam. 

The one thing I am doing is simple telling history as it is.Why don't you watch this video by a Mollah in Iran //www.youtube.com/watch?v=5w5Rm2dxpeI

المقنع

salman farsi
Fri Jun 17, 2011 03:19 PM PDT

And you will do all these from Los Angeles, New York, DC, London, Toronto, Paris and Monaco? :00

 For an Islamic democracy

Iranian

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Fri Jun 17, 2011 11:23 AM PDT

 

identity is based on Zoroastrian philosophy. Our new year is NowRuz; our greatest book is Shahnameh; our months have Zoroastrian names; our greatest hero is Rostam; our greatest King was Cyrus the Great who was not a Muslim; our greatest achievements happened before Islam.

Of course since you are most likely not Iranian you do not know these. It was only during the Safavids that Shia was forced on Iranian. We are now again rejecting it.

Salman

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Fri Jun 17, 2011 11:17 AM PDT

 

Iranian identity is the antithesis of Islam in all ways. The proof is our celebrations; our traditions and our history. You go stamp your feet all you want. But almost all Iranians I know despise Islam.

And thank you Islamic Theocracy for that announcement from Gaza

by Hooshang Tarreh-Gol on Fri Jun 17, 2011 09:38 AM PDT

or is it South of Lebanon. You're obviously not an Iranian but if you were, you might have recalled all the blood used to making Iranian and Islamic identities 'inexricably insepearable,' during th e past 1400 years, especially the past32 years 

The funniest part, and it shows how ignorant, arrogant you are about Islam, yeah the funniest part is that your Shiite hell, is not even considered Islam (correctly so) in the eyes of real muslims. All this shia gibberish is creation of bunch of pedophile mullahs with you as their 'intellectual' pimp. Keep on dreaming.

=================================

 

حكومت ولايت وقيع و دولت امام زمان و مذهب شيعه كه هر طرفدار آن هستند -
شيعه ساخته آخوندها - چون در قرآن اسمي از مذهب شيعه برده نشده است و
پيامبر اسلام هم مذهب شيعه را نداشت و در زمان انها اصلا مذهب شيعه نبود
آخوند ها مذهب شيعه و مراجع تقليد و مقلد درست كرده اند و به اسم به خورد
مردم داده اند

Whether you like it or not

by salman farsi on Fri Jun 17, 2011 09:19 AM PDT

Islam and Iranian identity are inextricably insepearable. You make a number of claims or assumptions that simply cannot be corroborated like christianity has no place in the core values of democracy!! You assume that democracy was an externally implanted organ in the body of the society - so thinks GW Bush and that is why he (unsuccessfully) transplanted it in Iraq and Afghanistan. You see my friend you think linearly. You must begin to  think laterally.  Of course you take western democracy for granted because you have lived in it long enough to adopt it as your own but the people who have lived in Iran under that IRI's dictatorship or in Afghanistan under the Taleban or in Egypt under Mubarak are not going to adopt the same values that you have so easliy adopted just to be (westernly) democratic.

The Islamic demcoracy gives to the inhabitants of the Islamic societies that which the western demcracies cannot give to the Iranians/Afghan/sTurks/Iraqis/Egyptians/Tunisians/etc. Its is called: organicly grown identity.

 

And for the nth time, the anti-IRI is NOT an Islamic democracy.

 For an Islamic democracy

Salman

by hirre on Thu Jun 16, 2011 07:44 AM PDT

Clearly many institutions in the west were formed based on christianity. But the system has evolved. Christianity has no longer a place in the core values of democracy. The question is, what values are so genuine for an islamic democracy that doesn't already exist within current democratical forms? What new elements does islam bring and what problems does it solve?

The world becomes more and more globalized, the governments of the future have to understand that people are no longer bound to regional traditions and cultures. Therefore there needs to be a system which incorporates this, and that is democracy. Now if you put something previous to the word "democracy", e.g. "islamic democracy", you must be able to explain what you mean by that.

How will an islamic democracy differ from a "western" democracy? Will it use rules from the quran incorporated in the laws of the society? Which laws are unique for islam that have not been thought of before? Basically, what does islam contribute with, that doesn't already exist in current democratical societies? E.g. is Iran an islamic democracy?

You say that we accept these values. I would argue that we take them for granted. If we look at countries in the middle east people are fighting for the same values that we take for granted. It's a universal cause with universal values which has grown out of religion, although once based on it...

One could compare the battle of political systems with the battle between two products from different companies. If one product is "better" by the decision of the people, they will not buy the other product, even though the other product is in a store nearby...

Al Ahmad

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Thu Jun 16, 2011 04:31 AM PDT

 

was a xenophobe idiot whose small mind was frighted by new things. He goes to USA for a week; stays in NYC and then claims to know all about USA. What an arrogant ***. This was our idea of an-tellectual. I would drop the "tellectual" and leave the first part to describe him. Garbzadegi my foot! Before Islam we invited Greek and Romans to come to Iran and would learn from them. Then we got Islam and ignorance. The fruit of which were such as Al Ahmad and Shariati.

Hirre

by salman farsi on Thu Jun 16, 2011 03:55 AM PDT

You are clearly blanking the Judeo-Christian roots of what you describe as western democracies. The concepts such as emphasis on individual morality, or equality of believers were not beamed down from planet Mars or reached at by reasoning. These plus others formed the religious-cultural influences on what you now enjoy as a western democracy within which you have such parties as Chirstian and Muslim democrats. American and European democracies are deeply based on the Judeo Christian ideals (in addition to Greco-Roman and Reformist legal concepts) You guys are all happy and cheerful to accept these values without questioning their origins but when it comes to the Islamic values wth which you have lived for one and a half millennia you suddenly recreate yourselves as western idealists (Al Ahamad kojaaee ke bebini gharb zadegi be koja resideh)

 For an Islamic democracy