Chelokabab in China

Photo essay with captions :)

by yolanda
29-Aug-2010
 
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Rosie.

Hi, Yolanda, I'm...

by Rosie. on

glad to see the thread is continuing. I am also on vacation and have less access than before, but will comment again soon. I did want to say that I clicked on his name here and saw that Bijan's (aka Obama's aka Goldust's)account has been deleted again. This seems rather harsh. He put his photo and real name, surely it was a display of good faith. Well I hope he comes back in a more saintly version so as to be worthy of gracing the hallowed halls of these threads.


yolanda

.....

by yolanda on

Hi! Mouse,

    Thank you for your post and links.....I visited yesterday....wow! The guy has won so many awards and honors! "Heartwrenching" is perfect word for what is going in Iran and what has been going on in Iran for the past 31 years. I hope the guy will keep making good movies.......I know it is not easy 'cause he is in exile......it is not easy to find funds and investors to make a movie......It looks like he can not go back to Iran at this moment....but I hope he can still use his talents to express himself and make a difference!


Anonymouse

TEA party candidates r ALL coo coo! First him & now witchcraft!

by Anonymouse on

Faramarz jaan that's a good cartoon!  We'll be hearing a lot more about him.  That district is a Republican stronghold and he is all but guaranteed a seat in the House!

The new Tea party darling in Delaware was a former witchcraft nut and when her video surfaced this weekend she went underground and cancelled ALL her TV Sunday shows!

I'm looking forward to the Jon Stewart and Colbert rallies in DC on Oct 30th to bring bang sanity! 

Everything is sacred


Faramarz

Anonymouse, Doonesbury

by Faramarz on

Anonymouse,

Sunday's Doonesbury was very similar to a piece that you wrote about Dan Quayle's son, Ben a while back!

Your use of apple and potato (sib, sibzamini) was very clever!

 

Now you are anonymously famous!

 

//www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2010/09/19/


Anonymouse

Yolanda, Makhmalbaf has a whole family of filmmakers

by Anonymouse on

You can lookup Makhmalbaf Film House for more about this family.  Two of his daughters (Samira and Hana) have made really good movies (semi-documentaries) at very young age, Samira at 17 and Hana at 14 I think.  Samira was made famous by the movie (The Apple).  Unfortunately after the election crackdowns last year they are outside Iran and not able to make the movies they want in Iran.

They are also controversial and don't be surprised if you hear stories about them.  I like them and have seen most of their movies.

Their films are also very heartwrenching, some extremly heartwrenching.  So be aware.  One of the most heartwrenching movies I've seen is Samira's Two Legged Horse. I think she used some artistic license and pushed it and some people didn't like it.  I saw some people walk out of the movie because they thought she was appealing and pushing the audience feelings.  I don't think she had to do it and the story was painful enough without her making it more painful. 

Everything is sacred


yolanda

......

by yolanda on

Hi Rosie,

1) I did some of your "assigned" homework and read about Makhmalbaf....the guy is absolutely brilliant and his whole family is involved in movie-making......he is also a great writer, a screen playwright, and a film studies teacher......many of his films are critcally acclaimed and won awards internationally.....the sad thing is that some of his moives are banned or neglected by IRI....so his movies could not reach to wider audiences....that is a shame! Wow! his daughter is so beautiful!

2) I "smuggled" the mimosa from Beijing to Honolulu, but could not smuggle the mimosa all the way to CA.......but the good thing is that my mom bought mimosa seeds off internet and has successfully grown 11 mimosas out of 15 seeds......she bought 1000 mimosa seeds for $10........now the mimosa is about inch and half tall......the leaves close upon being touched...very exciting!.....I plan to take it to work and show it off to my colleagues.

3) I found an extraordinary video being shot inside the tank which was stopped by the Chinese tank man in 1989 Tiananmen protest...

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyPgHwB82xY&feature=related

4) I found this Chinese Tajik movie clip......a little boy (Amir) tried to buy his girlfriend's freedom.....but he did not have enough money.....his girlfriend was sold as a slave......the boy mentioned "Allah"......the mosque looks Persian to me......this clip shows that Amir grew up and joined the Chinese army.....the love song reunited them....but in the army.....there was no freedom of dating or love life.....Amir had to get his boss' permission to hug his childhood sweetheart:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=PefCjyEK_eo&feature=related

take care!


Rosie.

Well,

by Rosie. on

just wanted to say that you also gave me some homework! lol. And also that the three long posts were written on two separate days over a three day period, just so you know I don't mean to inundate you. Actually though I thought I should make a small correction about the Ghashghai (Qashqai). I had a feeling I was wrong in what I wrote and I checked:

It isn't true that the ghashghai are 'almost completely sedentary now'. They are LARGELY sedentary but far from completely. This is a strange and fascinating thing because, as you can imagine, both the Shah and IRI have done everything possible to stop nomadic wanderings. (As I recall from previous readings, before the Revolution, the tribes were promised all kinds of things and as you can imagine, every promise was broken...). What is amazing is to think, when you watch Gabbeh, that that story could happen today,

Okay, then, later and mimosas.


yolanda

......

by yolanda on

Hi Rosie,

    Thank you for your 3 long posts......wow, you gave me a lot of homework to do.......I only watched one video......I will watch the rest of the videos this weekend.....I found more Chinese Uyghur videos and Chinese Tajik movie clips......the mosque in the Chinese Tajik area looks Persian to me......I got excited!

I have some good news about mimosa, the sensitive & dynamic plants.....

Talk to you later!

take care!


Rosie.

ps

by Rosie. on

I just did a very quick google and found an article on the uprising a couple of years ago which said this:

Then the women started demonstrating for the right to wear the hijab at work. The protests were rapidly quelled.

So that confirms that the hijab isn't allowed in the public sector--at schools, etc. (Technically in China all 'work places' could be considered to at least some extent 'public sector...). But it doesn't answer the question as to why almost no one appears to be wearing it in the videos as everyday wear. Maybe I'll do a more extensive search on it when I have more time. This is all very interestiing. It's nice to actually be learning something here instead of watching everyone argue and winding up arguing too....(not to mention the occasional evisceration...)


Rosie.

A couple more things (as promised....)

by Rosie. on

I thought it was very interesting that in the first video there is actually a woman in something that looks like a burqa, only it's a very special burqa. It's bright red and a bit transparent. Very provocative, actually (within the parameters of the usual potato sack effect, that is...) The nomadic Turks are known for their festive 'hijab' (as is seen in 'Gabbeh'...), but it is weird and unsettling to see that kind of festivity in burqa--i.e. shroud--form. I wonder if the Uiyghur (and other Chinese Turkic women) still 'cover', and how much. Overall the videos give the impression that they only do it for ceremonial purposes, and not always then. In the first video all the women have some form of hijab (including niqab and the one burqa...) but at the end of the marketplace one the dancers don't (only a couple of caps, which I doubt even represent 'hijab'....).

In the actual market part of the marketplace one, almost no one in the crowd has a headscarf, but then they mostly look Chinese to me, actually (???). The wife in the booth owner couple they show is wearing a head scarf, but maybe she does it partly for her own 'ceremonial purposes'--to give the 'ethnic' feel for the Chinese shoppers. Or maybe it's due to her age (not member of the younger generation...). Or both. I wonder. 

I would imagiine it's illegal in China to wear the headscarf in schools, etc., but I wonder about the streets. Although I'd wager they banned burqa and niqab waaaaay before the French did lol, I guess it'd be pretty hard to stop people from wearing simple scarves outdoors, wouldn't you say? (Although I'm sure the government would've loved to...) But unless I missed something, hardly anyone seems to be doing it nowadays. What do you know about it?


Rosie.

Hiiiiii, Yolanda,

by Rosie. on

Thanks for the videos. I watched all of them and will make some comments on them in a day or two. For now, just wanted to say a couple of things.

First one. Nope, no 'image consultant' hahaha. Just a friend that took a photo of me but said it was too dark and that he had to photo shop it and now he's dragging his feet...Having seen the image in the camera after he took it, I think the thing is probably fine, but he won't e-mail it to me until he 'finishes' it.

Second. Why do I have the sneaking suspicion that you are really into food, girl? lol

And last. I'm sending you another youtube link to a well-known Makhmalbaf film. Again it's the whole page, and I think it has the entire movie in segments. It's called 'Gabbeh', which means carpet, and is about a girl coming of age among the Qashqai (also spelled Ghashghai), who are a large nomadic Turkic tribe in Iran. Well, actually, they have become almost completely sedentary in modern times of course. Since we are on the subject of Turks, I thought you'd be interested in the ones in Iran proper. Apparently they are related to the Azerbajanis.

I really do recommend that you wiki Makhmalbaf. His bio is fascinating and captures a lot of the history and dilemmas of post-Revolutionary Iran. Also if you ever get a chance to see these films in a theater, you absolutely should. The colors and scenes are splendid. HIs early period was dark, dark, dark, and the films are grim. But they become bright and beautiful later on, in tandem with his progressive alienation from the regime. Here is Gabbeh.

//www.youtube.com/results?search_query=makhmalbaf+gabbeh&aq=f

 

 


yolanda

.....

by yolanda on

Hi! Rosie,

  Wow, You have an image consultant to photo-shop your avatar photo! You must take your IC hobby very seriously! ....I like to take pictures very much, but I don't like to take my own pictures!

  I think Uyghurs and I look alike to certain extent: Uyghurs have 2 eyes.... me, too.....Uyghurs have one nose, I have one nose, too!

  I saw this Uyghur video with Daf (Persian frame drum), girls with hijab, Persian style musical instruments, Persian carpet/tapestry, and Persian style structure.....the end of the video becomes scary.....it has the scenes from last year's Uyghur riots.....it is more violent than Iran's post-election protests.....190 people died in 2 days....

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFNOHi56Skw

I found this Chinese Tajik music video.....I believe Tajiks are closer to Persians than Uyghurs....their language is pretty close to Farsi. This is a love song, the lyrics shocks me.....2 verses say:" If Allah is not upset with me, you are my Allah..."....the singer has very pretty eyes.......the musicians played Daf and Persian string instrument.

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=qW8xd2wAirk

  This video shows the entire sheep is barbecued including the sheep head:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjD8aqQlowQ

 Xinjiang night market......at the end of the video, I saw daf and Persian style home interior and carpet:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3A1HPmLNK0

This music video is the 2008 Beijing Olympic song......it has Farsi subtitles......I recognized many historical sites in this video I have visited in Beijing, like Forbidden City, Great Wall, Temple of Heaven, Summer Palace, the Bird's Nest Stadium, Water Cube, etc:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiKXMvFC3S0

Jackie Chan sang in front of the Great wall.

take care!

 

 


Rosie.

When you have more time...

by Rosie. on

you should upload your own photo for the avatar and then WE can decide whether you look Uyhur or not! lol I am also keeping my cyber activities down to a minimum for now but nonetheless have been in the process of uploading my own photo. The problem is it was too dark so the guy who took it is (taking forever) photo shopping it. I used my own photo before on my other two a/cs but didn't have a more recent one to upload here. It's coming...well, I'll be waiting for yours...lol again.

Take care you too!


yolanda

,,,,

by yolanda on

Hi! Rosie,

   Thank you for your research.....Uyghurs don't look like happy campers to me under the Chinese rule......Xinjiang is supposed to be land of Uyghurs...but all the high officials in Xinjiang are Chinese......I don't think it is fair.......Uyghurs are poor and uneducated.......many of them are unemployed.......no wonder they wanted to secede.........

OMG! When I was in Beijing...whole bunch of people asked me if I am Uyghur......I told them I am not......(of course, I am interested in the Uyghur stuff, the food, music, culture)....they acted like "they can't be wrong!" It cracked me up!

    Sorry, lately I have been pretty busy in the real world.....so did not do much in the cyber world.......I look forward to Thanksgiving!

   Thank you for all the info.......

Please take care!

 


Rosie.

Hi again again, Yolanda. Dotting i's and crossing t's...

by Rosie. on

About whether or not Xinjiang was ever part of the Persian Empire, apparently if it was it was only very briefly and long ago. It appears for about 2000 years it has been pretty much dominated politically by the Chinese, Mongolians, TIbetans, etc., at various times and at one time even fairly strong 'empire' of its own. If we are mainly concerned with the current cultural similarities between the Xinjiang and Iran, we are dealing with the past 1400 years maximum (post-Islamic), so whether it was ever part of the ancient Persian empire (which a cursory websearch doesn't tell me it was...) is rather irrelevant.

Likewise, if we are interested in physical similarities it should be pretty much irrelevant because as you know, the earlier Persians were of a different type. I would suppose that the physical similarities come both from other Turkic tribes within Iran and also from the Mongol invasions of both Iran and the Xinjiang.

The most striking cultural similarities I imagine would come from the Xinjiang being part of the Silk Road route, as 'Obama' pointed out here, which is almost as old as  persia. And also probably the progressive Persianization and Islamization of Mongol culture which I mentioned before as seen in Moghul India.

Of course, knowledgeable Iranians here could comment on this better than me.

________

Again, regarding IRI's relationship to the current situation of the Chinese Muslims which you brought up again, it has been independent Ayatollahs (and maybe politicians, not sure...) who have spoken out for the Muslims and decried the government's lack of outcry, rather than the government itself speaking out. However among them have been at least a couple of very important Ayatollahs.

Maybe there will be some official IRI comments or suggestions to the Chinese government, but I doubt it would go any further than that even if all hell froze over and more. Military (or even financial) least of all.

(ditto, knowledgeable Iranians could...)

***


Rosie.

Hi again,

by Rosie. on

I didn't say you said the mosque was Uiygur, it's just that we had been talking so much about them, I thought it was interestingthat it was Tatar. Also because it happens that at one point the Tatars had ravaged Iran.. Apparently many different tribes have settled in the Xinjiang over the course of history.

Regarding 'Iranian studies', well, you are setting ujp unnecessarty limitations for yourself. You can often take courses non-credit, non-matriculated, and then you don't have to write the papers (or really even take the tests, although it is a good idea to take them anyway, mho, since it keeps you on the straight and narroww lol--disciplined I mean...).  I believe you said you live in the LA area???? They have courses galore in Persian studies there, probably more than anywhere else in the country.

I am going to look into the question of whehter the Xinjiang was part of the Persian empire. Take care.


yolanda

......

by yolanda on

Hi! Rosie,

    Thank you......The video I posted is a mosque in Xinjiang......I said it looks very Persian to me with Persian "Iwan".......I did not say it is Uyghur mosque....actually in Xinjiang there are Tajiks and Kazakh, Kyrgyz besides Uyghurs and the regular Chinese.

    Well, I never had any Iranian studies, none! I am not sure if there are any in my area.......I think I like to read Iranian stuff at my own pace and pleasure......if I take a formal Iranian studies course, I may get a bad grade & shut down.......they usually make you write papers for that type of class.......that will be too much for me. I am a bad writer!

Thank you for all the info and take care!


Rosie.

Hi

by Rosie. on

I watched all the videos......the scenes do remind me of Uyghurs.....I believe the movie director is Mousavi's oversea spokesperson......

Yes, he is the one. It would still be well worth renting the movie and watching it on as large a screen as possible. It is lush. In case you don't know, Makhmalbaf is one of the three 'giants' of the boom in Iranian cinema in the '90's, at which time it was considered THE finest in the world among critics. The other two are Kiarostami and Bezaei (although Bezaei isn't really known outside of Iran). Makhmalbaf's bio is particularly interesting. Suggest you read about him on Wiki.

I am envious of the fact that you were involved in Iranian studies...it sounds very exciting!

I only meant in the sense of independent study. The only formal univeristy education I had in it was a several week intermediate level language intensive, but that was after I had done the elementary level as a self-study.

Here is a video of mosque in Xinjiang, China.....it looks very Persian with Persian style "iwan"...the Taj Mahal in India has the similar Persian iwan also:

//www.youtube.com

Yes, bearing in mind that the Moghuls of Moghul India were essentially Persified Mongols. After their devastating conquests in Asia, they chose Persian as the language of high culture and the court.

This mosque is not Uyghur, it is Tartar. On top of the video it does say so and I did check on Google. It is true.

The Tartars were another Turkic tribe which swept through Iran, leaving behind depredation, after the Mongols. (Which were not Turks, of course, but Mongolians, they had the very Chinese-like features).

I went to the thousand year old mosque (Nu Jie Mosque) in Beijing, but could not get in......I found a video showing the interior of the famous Beijing mosque........the inside is absolutely gorgeous.......at 1:34, it shows a picture of former Iranian president Khatami (?) with a Chinese mullah?

Yes, it is Khatami. I'm surprised at you!!! You can do a Google image search. you know, and verify for yourself, master googler as you are.

 

(No offense please if I told you things you already know...yoou know how i am... :o)

 


yolanda

....

by yolanda on

Hi! khaleh mosheh,

     You are very welcome!  I agree with you that life is so short.......time is very limited also.....I did not get the chance to see all the historical sites.....oh, gosh, there are so many interesting sites and museums in Beijing alone.....it would take a month to see everything! Initially I even planned to visit Shanghai World Expo (Iran has a pavilion also)...and then realized that I did not even have enough time to see everything in Beijing!

please take care!

***********************

Hi! Rosie,

    I watched all the videos......the scenes do remind me of Uyghurs.....I believe the movie director is Mousavi's oversea spokesperson......IC posted his video(s) before......he won award for his different movies....I am envious of the fact that you were involved in Iranian studies...it sounds very exciting!
   Here is a video of mosque in Xinjiang, China.....it looks very Persian with Persian style "iwan"...the Taj Mahal in India has the similar Persian iwan also:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSJ6yzno0mw&feature=related

I wonder if Xinjiang was part of Persian Empire long time ago.......a lot of stuff looks Persian to me!

   I went to the thousand year old mosque (Nu Jie Mosque) in Beijing, but could not get in......I found a video showing the interior of the famous Beijing mosque........the inside is absolutely gorgeous.......at 1:34, it shows a picture of former Iranian president Khatami (?) with a Chinese mullah?

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=krft3swh08M

I think Iran supports Muslims in China to certain extent, not military support, but moral support!

Here is a video showing a guy jumping over the Great Wall:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEiAj4jt7fs


Rosie.

Oh, Yolanda, ps

by Rosie. on

now you make me think of Makhmalbaf's film, Sokoot about a little blind boy filmed in Tajikistan. When I saw it I was so astonished by the fusion of cultures and how beautifully it was depicted: the Persian, Chinese, (I guess it was Uiyghur...), and also the Russian. And the architecture and monuments, a couple of which were Buddhist. I was really astonished. I hadn't ever seen anything like that before.To be honest, I didn't even really know anything like that existed.

You are bringing up a lot of memories for me because I saw that film when I was first getting involved in Iranian studies (2003), and it was a very intense time. Here is the link to the youtube page with many scenes from the film. The first one is the opening. Even if you've seen it before, you will love to see it again for sure. I did. And if you haven't, it is a must.

//www.youtube.com/results?search_query=silence+makhmalbaf&aq=f

(btw the two cherries hanging from the girl's ears come from a line of Forrough's...)

___________

ps the trailer with a snippet of amazing music:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZYa2_HZi5Q&p=1B95E441B68B0DE6&playnext=1&index=11

 


Rosie.

GolbadoulI! Is it really you???!!!

by Rosie. on

I imagined you rather different. Sort of middle-aged and heavy-set with a kind of stern but clueless face and a big moustache.

I dunno why.


khaleh mosheh

Thanks for the photos

by khaleh mosheh on

I enjoyed looking at them a lot and wished I had been able to visit China also..Oh well life so short and so much to do.

Also loved the way you found the Persian restaurants in Beijing and presented them to us here.  

 

Thank you! 


Immortal Guard

Another Persian Grill House!

by Immortal Guard on

//www.parsgrillhouse.com/

On TV it says the manager is a Majid Karimi!

 


yolanda

.....

by yolanda on

Hi MPD,

   If I visit Iran, I will look for the Iranian mimosa tree.....I found mimosa in Farsi: درخت گل ابریشم

Mimosa means "silk flower" in Farsi...very interesting.....I will take a picture of mimosa tree with me......hopefully Iranian people don't think I am too weird!

Please take care!


yolanda

.....

by yolanda on

Hi MPD,

   If I visit Iran, I will look for the Iranian mimosa tree.....I found mimosa in Farsi: درخت گل ابریشم

Mimosa means "silk flower" in Farsi...very interesting.....I will take a picture of mimosa tree with me......hopefully Iranian people don't think I am too weird!

Please take care!


yolanda

......

by yolanda on

Hi! Angel,

       Thank you! Right now the good time is pretty much over....I have to get ready to go back to work....it is hard......well, I will aim for Thanksgiving next!

******************* 

Hi! Rosie,

    I bought the exact same shirt like this in Beijing:

//cgi.ebay.com/Love-BEIJING-T-Shirt-Travel-Vacation-Tourist-Tee-/190378002013?pt=US_CSA_MC_Shirts&var=&hash=item72166842fb

   Xinjiang (The Uyghur land)  looks really Persian, the mosque is in Persian style....some ladies wear scarf on the street:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=wEvjKHN0s9g

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhUNo3eZTT4

In China, there are Farsi speakers......but it may not be the exact same Farsi spoken by Persians in Iran:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8-VAVJOXP8

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=A796OqHKU08

I read that Chinese Tajiks are shiite Muslims.

****************************

Hi! Red Wine,

    Thank you for reminding me that meat is bad.....you are 100% right! ....Meat can clog the arteries! I need to cut down on meat....Thank God that there is no donkey meat here......I recall that you mentioned you would (or will) go to China or Japan....I hope you had (or have) a great time. Japan is pretty close to Beijing......Beijing is only 90 minutes of flight from Seoul, Korea.

   You are great that you are a disciplined vegetarian. You will have longevity!


Red Wine

...

by Red Wine on

Thank you for pics Yolanda ...

Don't eat more meat my dear Yolanda.. be veg pls :=) .


Multiple Personality Disorder

Hi Yolanda,

by Multiple Personality Disorder on

The Mimosa tree shown on the youtube video, provided by you, is exactly the same kind of tree that I remember from the old days in Abadan.  Thank you for looking it up. 


Rosie.

Yolanda, you are surprised that IRI doesn't support the

by Rosie. on

Muslims in China?? This is a very old story. They are not going to rock the boat with China. More surprising to me is that the article was in Press Tv. But it did come with its own little propaganda:
"Unfortunately, these days, a greater and more horrific crime than what occurred in Germany … has taken place in China,"

i understand there is some region in the Xiniang where Chinese historically has been written with Persian characters.

And finally you're not going to tell me you couldn't find your tee shirt in Beijing, are you? lol 


Dirty Angel

What fun!

by Dirty Angel on

What a fun, lovely trip you're having!

Yeah!

Go Yolanda go!