Iran diplomat says was tortured in US custody
Press TV / WM/HGH/MMN
12-Jan-2010 (37 comments)

An Iranian diplomat who was detained by the US military in Iraq and held for more than two years, says that he was tortured while in American custody.

Majid Qaemi-Heydari was among the five Iranian diplomats who were abducted by American forces in a raid on Iran's consulate in Arbil on January 11, 2007.

In an interview with Fars News Agency, Heydari said the behavior of his American captors was worse than the violence they showed against Iraqis.

"They had put covers on our heads, they cuffed our hands," he said adding that the soldiers were later criticized for not cuffing the diplomat's hands behind them.

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jamshid

"matarsak"

by jamshid on

"the majority of iranians would side with the regime against such foreign bullies..."

The use of a foreign "matarsak" is a common method of "IRI champions" to create an illusion of sympathy and popularity for the regime.


Niloufar Parsi

asteroid

by Niloufar Parsi on

there is a background to all of this that you are not aware of. you could have guessed perhaps....? i'll be the judge of who i show respect to in this forum if you do not mind.

but i see your intentions are good and i always respect fairness. torture is torture and has to be condemned. it is utter hypocrisy to claim otherwise. i think we agree on that.

what i would like to point out to you is a simple, but important point that i think may be missing from your post: the fight for reform in iran cannot be carried out in a vaccum. we cannot ignore iran's relations with the US and the latter's misdeeds, especially in the region. this torture business is actually quite central to the story. as the world knows, US is guilty of war crimes (or call it another term if you prefer). so is israel. the two of them try to lead the charge against iran. with their record, we have to be weary of that or the majority of iranians would side with the regime against such foreign bullies.


AsteroidX

I agree Noulifar

by AsteroidX on

But the point people are making here is that we have people that are happy posting articles trying to deflect attention from worse horrors in Iran. This is what is bothering people here, and why the redicule and frustration. And the chap who posted this article never responded to my point about the coverups in Iran where they torture and kill.

To be honest, you cannot accuse others of character assassination when you do the same to other people. Come on Noulifar.


Niloufar Parsi

Asteroid

by Niloufar Parsi on

i am totally fine with discussing all such issues as long as we are talking rather than engaging in character assassination for no good reason. that is both childish and boring. we have better things to do with our time, don't you think?

of course torture is abhorrent and against humanity, no matter who it is practised by. the subject of this debate is torture by the US. if we are going to point fingers, the onus is on those who are refusing to condemn US torture actually. we should not make excuses for iranian or american torture. does that explain?

Peace


AsteroidX

Niloufar

by AsteroidX on

If you do not like his comment and what it reveals about you , do not resort to put downs which everyoine can see through. I still see you have not commented about torture in Iran, which I would have thought would be of greater interest to your flesh and blood.

We should not wait for others to change before we change ourselves for the better. You know the saying - "People in glasshouses do not throw stones". We should clean up our own house first (Iran) and concentrate on that. Then we should point the finger. Ofcourse I do not like Iranians being tortured abroad, but are we not working for a better IRAN? Deflection only makes us remain what we are.


Niloufar Parsi

jamshid

by Niloufar Parsi on

i will engage with you when you grow up and debate like an adult.


jamshid

AsteroidX

by jamshid on

I completely agree with you. These people don't engage and argue with you when they know you have their number, and when they know that their common methods of diversion, sophistry and ultimately arbadeh keshi and hochi gari won't work against you.


AsteroidX

jamshid

by AsteroidX on

You do not bore me or others. Say the truth, no matter what childish insults are thrown at you. I note none of these people have answered my post about Dr. Pourandarjani, who was poisoned to death because he did not want to take part in a cover up of torture that cause the death of a protester(s) - Mohsen Ruholamini -  in Kahrizak Detention centre .

After all we are here to talk about Iran and better Human Rights in Iran aren't we? Not to deflect to other parts of the world and what they do.


jamshid

Niloufar Parsi

by jamshid on

Your lack of argumentation is not a reflection of anyone's need to grow up. It is only a reflection of your lack of argumentation. Period.


Niloufar Parsi

jamshid

by Niloufar Parsi on

told you before: grow up kid!


jamshid

Niloufar Parsi

by jamshid on

"when the self-appointed 'champion' of 'human rights' resorts to barbarism, what chance is there against others?"

Are you justifying and apologizing for IRI's barbarism? No matter how the US government might have turn its back to true human right values, still, they are miles ahead of the IRI in this area.

As always you have spoken like a true "champion" of the IRI. Your shame has no limits.


Niloufar Parsi

maiser

by Niloufar Parsi on

thanks for posting. sad to see some hearltess comments here.

torture was made legal in the US, and as far as I know, no one in authority - and actually responsible for the policy - has been punished for it since obama took office. most probably, it is still being used routinely in iraq, afghanistan and guantanemo as well as many sub-contracted locations such as israel, jordan, syria and egypt, to name a few.

when the self-appointed 'champion' of 'human rights' resorts to barbarism, what chance is there against others?

peace


StoneHenge

Hollywood movie

by StoneHenge on

President Obama issued a serious investigation into Torture in
Guantanamo Bay and Abu Gharib Prisons and those who commited any

alledged "torture" particularly in Abu Gharib were condemned.

Who ever said this is living in a Hollywood Movie... loooooooooool... 

 Obama is a sign for slavery in Amerikkka..... he is a black painted puppet and has always been... never since he has been in office has he kept his word... he is worst than his predecessor! 

However, they did not treat the reasons that led to this condition. I believe that the conditions in the Palestinian territories are alway capable of explosion because the same circumstances are there.


AsteroidX

Quasimodo

by AsteroidX on

I am not here on Iranian.com to discuss or divert attention to any other country. Not Us, UK, Palestine, etc. I care about Iranians in Iran.  I do not condone ANY torture ANYWHERE.

"you have no choice but to go with the trend and I dont consider this freedom."

But my dear, I do not go with the trend. You do not even know me and you are making so many assumptions.

"You HAVE TO go with the flow or you will be considerd an "outcast". "

I am sorry you think that, maybe your experience has been different to mine. I truly sympathise if that is true in your case.

"Dont you think non-US citizens also should have same rights? Do Americans also tourture their own citizen or this luxury is only for other "inferior" nationalities?  "

I think you should ask someone who lives in the US about rights. I live in Europe. I am very sad that you may have been treated badly.  Even though you are a regime supporter I still care about you.


Quasimodo

AsteroidX

by Quasimodo on

If you have chosen to live in the west then good for you, enjy your "freedom". I think people of your type are content with the empty freedom they get in the west, as long as you are happy. But in reality, you have no choice but to go with the trend and I dont consider this freedom. If you open your mind and stop thinking one dimentionally you will see that the "freedom" you get in the west in not by choice. You HAVE TO go with the flow or you will be considerd an "outcast". But enough of lecturing you, I like to get back to the subject and would like to know your openion on US attrocities to other nations. Dont you think non-US citizens also should have same rights? Do Americans also tourture their own citizen or this luxury is only for other "inferior" nationalities? 


AsteroidX

Masier

by AsteroidX on

What do you think about this story?

//iranian.com/main/news/2009/12/20/doctor-who-defied-tehran

Dr. Pourandarjani was poisoned to death because he did not want to take part in a cover up of torture that cause the death of a protester(s) - Mohsen Ruholamini -  in Kahrizak Detention centre .


AsteroidX

Quasimodo

by AsteroidX on

You sound like you've got the hump in a bad way.

Obviously you live in a parallel universe. I CHOSE to live in the West and I love it.  And noone is my "master", that's the good thing about living in democracies - everyone has a voice and freedom to chose their way of life. No religious "rishou bisavad" telling them what to do or else.

Now go ring your mosque's bells ...


Quasimodo

American Masters ?

by Quasimodo on

I wounder why these so called pro "green" movement members are so apologetice about US actions ! US government the "land of freedom" which incidently most of you have taken refuge in is an evil entity hated but most world population, yet some losers have grabbed to this imperisalist entity for help. Have some dignity. Have some self respect.


AsteroidX

Masier

by AsteroidX on

"So, you rather believe in Obama"

How old are you? What type of logic and argument is this? Do you actually understand why your own people want change, or are you happy to be brain washed into the mentality of the regime that uses deflection to "arch enemies" to sweep under the carpet crimes on its own people? The problem is Iranians care about Iranians and want their own government to treat them better. The argument that US or Israel is our enemy HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IRANIANS WANTING CHANGE IN IRAN. Please please think about it.


maiser

Ok here we go again

by maiser on

I posted a respond to you "FG" yesterday but something must have gone wrong, since my response is not here now.

 

Anyway. If you asked me that, i would simply tell you that i dont have a wife and if i had a wife i would not beat her. But when i question this user, if he supports repressive US policies and especially pin-point the fact that this report was about a Iranian, he gives me no clear answer and im afraid i come to conclusions.


jamshid

FG, Great

by jamshid on

FG, Great job exposing the IRI ministry of information's diversive tactics.


default

Mr. Kadivar

by IranMilitaryForum.net on

President Obama issued a serious investigation into Torture in
Guantanamo Bay and Abu Gharib Prisons and those who commited any
alledged "torture" particularly in Abu Gharib were condemned.

 

If that is an example of "trust in the system". then I have to ask you Where have you been? A quick historical read of the US history (and you should know better) would tell you the art of mockery of the US government in many cases not the least the joke called investigations into Abu-Gharib, Gitmo and Bagram airport.

I am baffeled by your naive and poor presentation of reality as related to history!

 

 

 

 

 


FG

Maiser: "Are you STILL beating your wife?"

by FG on

 A LESSON IN LOGIC AND LOGICAL FALLACIES

re: "Are you saying it is OK to torture diplomats, and do you support US policies on this matter?"

Your repeated question is loaded and flawed in EXACTLY the same way as my question to you above.   The tactic is to trick someone into agreeing with an UNPROVEN premise.  Only if the premise is proven first and beyond a doubt is the question fair.       

Consider the trap set up by using the word "still" in the above header implies whether one answers "yes" or "no."  it is the questioner who must provide proof that the alleged beatings occurred, not the person questioned.   Same goes for your allegations of torture which involve many logical problems:

1. ARGUMENT BY ANALOGY FALLACY

That some torture occurred is both cases is undeniable.  What differs massively is the degree and extent of torture, the nature of thje victims, to what extent torture was encouraged or restrained by superiors (waterboarding, sleep deprivation) or and to what degree it involved misconduct by low level individuals acting on their own (Al Ghairib) and whether those engaged in the latter were promptly investigated, arrested where suitable evidence werr found, tried or sententenced if found gujilty (Al Ghairib again).

In Iran, the regime kills people (Nada, the doctor, Moussavi's cousin) and blames others (foreigners, the MKO, boy friends, the opposition, Israel, the CIA), rather thabn investigates fairly.  It sometimes gives us six different "anyone but us" theories for the same crime (Neda).  The fact the regime refused to allow a free, open and transparent media because, as in the case of earlier death squads, in tantamount to admitting it has much to hide.   Othewise why fear a free press?

2. FALLACY OF DEGREE (black and white fallacy).   Waterboarding and sleep deprivation--allowed under past official policy, are not comparable in degree to beating the imprisoned to death, raping them, braking their bones, arresting their relatives and torturing them in the next room to induce confessions, etc. 

3. RED HERRING ARGUMENT (deliberate diversion): 

Even had the US engaged in the exact same crimes and tactics used by Khamenei and his thugs, it's irrelevant as an excuse for the regime. 

The argument is tantamount to a guy who gets caught robbing a bank claiming that he should go free because "others robbed banks and didn't get caught."   That you avoid the entire issue and focus on diversion implicitly concedes you agree the regime has done the indefensible.

4. MORE ARGUMENT BY ANALOGY FALLACY

The nature of the imprisoned is not comparable.  Let's see who is being compared:

On the one hand, known members of Al Queda or those at least REASONABLY SUSPECTED of being linked with it or its allies were imprisoned.  Such people committed and aided real crimes, or were suspected of being involved in aiding such crimes, past and future.  The USA wasn't the only country targeted.  See also many countries east and west, and tens of thousands of moderate muslims killed around the world simply because they didn't enjoy an imposed Islamist lifestyle.

Put that way, you can see how silly the tactic is--a mere attempt to divert attention from the regime's horrendous crimes since you can hardly defend Neda's murder, Khamenei's death squads, the targeting of relatives of reformers, their arbitary arrests in the first place.

On the other hand, who are the regime's victims, journalists arrested for reporting on regime crimes, protestors like Neda shot in the street or Mousavi's nephew run over twice by a car and shot point blank,  women arrested for supporting the million signature referendum, students arrested for protesting rigged election or--as in the Khamenei area--new press censorship imposed after a freer media investigated and identified death squad members.   Sorry, but they don't compare to Al Queda.  


Sargord Pirouz

maiser

by Sargord Pirouz on

Pretty typical stuff, here, unfortunately. Discussion usually breaks down fast, with little gained in the form of real substance.

Ad hominem attacks, reduction to the absurd, accusations, invectives- all coming from the type of one track-minds you come to expect from disgruntled exiles, I'm sorry to say.

 


Darius Kadivar

In that Case ;0)

by Darius Kadivar on

I have a double good reason to Stone You to death  !

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=hsVAYFSEBrA

With No Guilty consciense

 

LOL


maiser

Im not apologing for anything

by maiser on

But you are.


Darius Kadivar

Yes I'm Also a Racist ;0)

by Darius Kadivar on

What are going to do about it ?

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpPaBwZoQkg

Particularly with IRI apologists like You !

LOL


Darius Kadivar

maiser Oh Yes Absolutely ;0)

by Darius Kadivar on

I'd Love to torture You especially in the Spanish Inquisition style ...

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSe38dzJYkY

When will you be available ? Bring along your friends too. The More the Merrier !

LOL


maiser

Your the claimer here

by maiser on

You and some of your supporters here are claiming that torture is OK(since you support US policies on this matter), and that it is especially OK if it is a IR employee(since they are all wretched in your opinion). And you also claim that US is doing good now-a-days in Guantanamo bay, and accuse me of being part of IR or that i must live away from the reality as i have a different point of view than you(offensive behaviour), or that i have to be Arabic (racism) because i question your logic.


maiser

So, you rather believe in Obama

by maiser on

So, you rather believe in Obama, and his mouth-pieces? The way some of you see it, everything is black and white, and you dont trust no-one on the one side, while you trust almost everything on the other side as long as it matches some pre-defined views of yours about IRI and Iran.

 

But still, you think its OK that a Iranian diplomat was tortured. You claim the government of Iran do all kinds of crimes, without possibly having all the facts to back it up with, but when there is a statement of a Iranian claiming to be tortured, its suddenly OK for you, or you say it must be a lie, or he is paid to say it, or he HAD to say it to save himself from the wretched IR. In fact, i felt you enjoyed the news and was proud of how good US handles these things, as you mentioned their way of handling guantanamo was exceptionally good, and as you openly was sarcastic about his sufferings.