The Lotus

road map?

a demo iran is that not another word 4 countries that let the west tell them what 2 do. and give them first dips and super cut rate in their mineral wealth while not realizing that they r being set up 4 a rape just like iraq was just like saudi will be twenty years from now. as blair has already planned that one out. just like silly ppl in indian who keep saying "america is our friend" when we all know america is no ones friend. they are just nazis who let blacks and false jews join in. why do ppl in the so-called third world keep letting white westerners and their non white slaves (oprah and the rest of the so-called african americans.) keep telling u what 2 do? why r u all so silly, weak and cowardily to your western block masters? why don't u all non-violent protest hollywood or paint the hollywood zionist sign red with pigs blood? why don't u tell the queen of england 2 go f herself and the horse she rode in on. 2 hell with the silly actor come house boy called the president. tell hillary and her aipac flunkies to turn themselves in 4 trial. ppl outside the west stand up and have a spine! stop dancing around the camp fire with ur bottle of whiskey! stand up! now! as the rail road (the great israeli expansion!) is a comin'!

Hi

Hi Souri,

I am glad you are around and wouldn't have it any other way. Don't pay attention to these guys. They are just being their normal selves !!

VPK

Hi, Ben

You wrote re 'roadmap' to democratization in Iran

But I have collected some stuff in my own page for those who are interested to be briefed in where I'm going.

What do you mean by 'on your own page'?

I'm always around, rest assured!

But don't give a dime to the stupid comments.

آقا سلام بر شما

والله نامهایی بر می گزینید که من با آرامش خیال نمی توانم بکار ببرم.  می ترسم توهین آمیز باشند.  حالا، بی شوخی یک بررسی از زمینه تحصیلی فعالان سیاسی نیم قرن اخیر از جناحها مختلف غالب و مغلوب عموما چنین گرایشی را نشان می دهد.

درود بر همۀ مهندسان

Niloufar

niloufar i like mostly what u wrote but how do u think iran can change when the west is doing black ops mission there which would be called terrorism if someone did those things in the west or israel. when they are increasing drug dealing ops shipments, causing a huge cocaine problem there 2 the u.k and u.s using it's spies 2 cause more internal problems like the did to the soviets trade unions and u.k miners in the 1980's.

how or why won't iran gov do the right thing by it's ppl. hanging a teenage girl for just wearing a pair of jeans. punishing women who have turned 2 selling themselves 2 feed their own children. when they should be helping them like they did before. and why won't iran ppl do right by each other. as time 4 u is running out. as hillary "i want to be the harlot in purple" clinton has already said at aipac rally that iranian rev guard and all forms of iranian miltary r a "terrorist force" and will be treated as so. the plan 4 iran is go 2 go it's a very simple yet clever plan copied half from a old sci-fi tv show. to the tatics of a killing box! plus something else? here in uk it's like iraq and all of this has not even happen or is just like a bad tv show that no body want 2 watch.

i just don't understand niloufar why won't they put aside their so-called differences. as when the west and soviets backed saddam to invade and destroy iran u stood up as one ppl and refused to go quietly into the night. u refused to put on a yellow badge and turn the other cheek! they gave him, saddam everything except the atomic bomb to destroy you! and yet men and boys along with (never admitted 2?) girls who took off their hijabs and cut there hair short picked up and rocked a AK, stood afraid. they ran through minefields and danced a dance of death through clouds of poison gas and in coming metal storms of bullets and bombs. they stood up against the whole world and said. NO! WE WILL NOT GO! now it will be time soon 2 do it again. real soon. but this time u will fail because u will not stand together! u will not even do right by each other but more importantly u will not do right for yourselves.

As peace is just another word 4 surrender as far as the west is concerned. the boxes in hollywood r all ticked hillary is just waiting the plan is good to. THE CLOCK IS SET AT 5 TO MIDNIGHT! i know u don't belive it but it will happen. they r coming 4 u. get ready be ready. good luck!   

Mr. Avaznia

I realized what you were talking about although I am a Mohandess, :-), [purposely replaced part of your statement with .....]! My comment was partly for mezaah, partly for highlighting your comment regarding gharb which is very applicable to the current situation.... it was also a test to see if Souri "jaan" was still around!

##best regards

Regime and people

are two very different things. People are the ones being shafted. Regime is the one shafting them. Simple to understand as long as people have an open mind. 

It happens all the time. Does anyone think Saddam was the same as Iraqui people. Or Kim is the same as Korean people. By god some of the things I read are so out there to give me a hearburn.

VPK

مهندس و پزشک و

نظرم به سر وکار داشتن با تاریخ بود.

حالا که هر مهندس و پزشک و شیمی دانی آستینها را بالا زده و سیاستمدار شده، کم کم داشتیم فراموش میکردیم که اگر ایشان پابرهنه وسط معرکه دویده اند و چپ و راست تزهای علوم انسانی می دهند، این زمینه مطالعاتی ما بوده است.  طفلک نیلوفر که کلی سیاست خوانده و محتاطانه و با روش کار دانش اجتماعی-خوانها نظری را بیان کرده انگار فراموش کرده که از زمان ملی شدن صنعت نفت مهندس بهتر بوده است. جامعه را مهندسی هم می توان کرد به همان سادگی که خانه ای را می توان ساخت یا از بن کند. 

Rafigh Kianouri and I (to Mr. Avaznia)

"کار من تا اندازۀ زیادی ...... مرده خوریست    "

" مسئله ما ارتباطی به رژیمهای خاص ندارد.  بدتر از تجارت برده چه میتواند
باشد؟ نامی مقدس در خدمت هدفی شوم. هیچ گرگی نمی گوید من آمده ام تا ترا
ببلعم.  جدا کردن حکومت ها از مردم بخشی از سرشت غرب است. تا چنین نکنند
که حکومت و غارت نمی توانند بکنند. "

Mr. Avaznia, the other day here in douzakh I saw Nouroddin (Rafigh marhoum Kianouri), ou kallehe maa raa khord, ma ham kalleh ou ra khordim, I hope our mordeh khori gives us both a fraction of what you have, (ma'refat and basirat 

Niloufar Parsi

"you cannot separate the regime from the people of the country like that. it's where we differ the most."

I don't need to. The IRI separated itself from the people of Iran by brutalizing and oppressing them and by taking away their dignity and their independent and sovereign will.

It looks like IRI's foreign masters and half masters have succeeded in separating the government from the people in Iran, and installing one that is serving foreign interests, instead of the people's will.

eroonman

i wrote the following to mazloom earlier, and i think it responds to your points too, he called the iri 'fascist'.

the iri is nowhere near being fascist. i know what it is about them that
'feels' fascist. how they treat us women for one. but even if we go
with the term 'fascist', iranian misogyny comes from somewhere within
iranian culture. iranian men need education not war. 

fixing such problems with the culture cannot begin from the position of
'no engagement'. i mean by us iranians in exile.

foreign governments will do whatever they like. they certainly don't
give a damn about iranian women. they only talk about bombs. things they
are allegedly 'afraid' of. they should be afraid of mirrors.

a part of this iranian culture is islamic. unfortunately, so is the
state. it reflects iranians. it did not have to be islamic, but it is
and it resembles majority iranians, and does gross injustice to 15% or
so non-shia (rough estimate).

all states reflect their own people. there is no real division between
the people and the state in that they are mirror images of each other.
neither can appear out of nowhere. a deeply unpopular regime would be
removed by now. this is often the case when a regime becomes unbearable
or fascistic in the way you and some others depict them to be. and it is
particularly the case in iran.

but we can see that it is not happening now. my guess is that it is
directly related to the foreign threat issue. the foreign threat is an
obstacle to change in iran.

regardless of external factors, and given that revolution is not
happening, if an iranian wants to alter her own country's state, she
will have to engage with both the people in iran and their state.

she also has the option of joining the war cries of israel and usa. but
it seems a terribly poor option to me.

Peace

chomsky (to KM)

is the most rational of them all, hands down. he never seems to be off target.

they've aleady got the bomb

they've aleady got the bomb, iran has had a nuclear progamme 4 a long time. as making a nuclear device is easy. the nuclear club itself has many more undeclared members from norway to japan. but as we all know the bomb itself is not user friendly. iran needs nuclear energy 4 something else. something far more dangerous that no nation must have. something that the west wants and will do anything 4. within the next two years iran will have it working their science as like nazi-germany and japanese empire is ready 2 overtake the west. we all know what happen next!

jamshid khan

i also agree with manoucher and km: you cannot separate the regime from the people of the country like that. it's where we differ the most.

vildemose

noted. you are entitled to your views. do you think i can express mine without constant abuse from you any time soon?

Rosie, VPK

Then ask me how to reach it and I will gladly explain 

For a moment I was scratching my head when the hell I wrote those lines, until I saw the last line above! 

This is not my space. I may do that in my own blog, if necessary. The popular demand should reach a critical mass though! For now, I'm killing worms around that project. That's what I was mostly doing since the beginning. But I have collected some stuff in my own page for those who are interested to be briefed in where I'm going.

The solution, if it needs to be explained, is not a solution. But the roadmap I'm proposing goes like this: creating a political organization abroad, which will support affiliated movements inside the country for a referendum between current constitution and the legitimate constitution of Iran. If IRI constitution is elected in the referendum, then those who want to reform it or whatever they want to do, have the legitimacy to do so. If (more likely when) the legitimate constitutional monarchy is restored, the interim government proceed with preparation of a constituent assembly to ratify and finalize the constitution and the future regime of Iran.

I don't think such blog will be necessary. Because the idea will be materialized through a collective effort. 

I second

Rosie's request. Please do explain your ideas and I promise to read them.

Benross

I don't like to be so critical of Persians. I like them.  My experience with other Irianians is a lot better than my experience with Americans.

I don't care if we have a direct translation for common sense so what? Say "harfe hesabi" or "fekre manteghi". Words don't matter anyway. It is actions. I have had dealings with Iranians and they were fine. Why do some of us like to minimize our people? If we don't show respect for ourselves no one else will.

I remember back in Iran my English teacher (after visiting the USA) telling us things. He said in the US people were all honest not like us Iranians. He said no one lied and people all did the right thing. Yes sure I see it in Goldman Sacks; Bush and so on. The American guy was insulting and arrogant. He stopped by to give some "parazite" aka "noise" and then stomped off. No doubt pleased with himself. If you like the company of such people you are welcome to them.

I prefer the company of Iranians. Even the ones I don't agree with over some pompous guy like that guy. I still am not sure what he wanted to accomplish. Do you know? If so please enlighten me as to his point. Just one thing: no riddles.

Ben, your post about halfway below reads:

by benross
on Sat Apr 24, 2010 07:38 AM PDT

We can talk forever about
freedom but unless we propose how to reach it and do it, the
words  remain as nothing but a big hollow drum.

Then ask me how to reach it and I will gladly explain.

_____________________________

Yes, I am asking. Please explain.

Robin Jayne Goldsmith

New York City

White-Washing AIPAC/etc. crimes (to ET)

:ET, here is what you said

"

The problem that today the world has is not with Iran or Iranians but with the regime that rules it and that applies to the use of nuclear technology also.

"

:Ironically here is what an Iranian patriot said

.............................

مسئله ما ارتباطی به رژیمهای خاص ندارد.  بدتر از تجارت برده چه میتواند
باشد؟ نامی مقدس در خدمت هدفی شوم. هیچ گرگی نمی گوید من آمده ام تا ترا
ببلعم.  جدا کردن حکومت ها از مردم بخشی از سرشت غرب است. تا چنین نکنند
که حکومت و غارت نمی توانند بکنند.

Dear Videmose

I just read the background info you mentioned (in Shazdeh's blog). When a person's political view is driven by family ties, it becomes the more difficult to argue with such person because of the natural trust that exist between a person and his/her family. But as I said in the other blog, that trust in turn could become a trap for the said person. 

منوچهر عزیز،

خبر کوتاه بود:
ـ «اعدامشان کردند.»

خروش دخترک برخاست.
لبش لرزید.
دو چشم خسته‌اش از اشک پُر شد،
گریه را سر داد . . .
و من با کوششی پُر درد، اشکم را نهان کردم.

ـ چرا اعدامشان کردند؟
می‌پرسد ز من با چشم اشک‌آلود،
چرا اعدامشان کردند؟

ـ عزیزم، دخترم!
آنجا، شگفت‌انگیز دنیایی است.
دروغ و دشمنی فرمانروایی می‌کُند آنجا.
طلا، این کیمیای خونِ انسان‌ها
خدایی می‌کُند آنجا.

در آنجا حق و انسان، حرف‌های پوچ و بیهوده‌ست.
در آنجا رهزنی، آدم‌کُشی، خون‌‌ریزی آزادست،
و دست‌و پای آزادی‌ست در زنجیر . . .

عزیزم، دخترم!
آنان
برای دشمنی با من
برای دشمنی با تو
برای دشمنی با راستی اعدامشان کردند!

و هنگامی که یاران،
با سرود زندگی بر لب،
به‌سوی مرگ می‌رفتند،
امیدی آشنا، می‌زد چو گُل در چشمشان لبخند.
به‌شوق زندگی آواز می‌خواندند.
و تا پایان به‌راه روشن خود باوفا ماندند.

عزیزم!
پاک کُن از چهره اشکت را، ز جا برخیز!
تو در من زنده‌ای، من در تو: ما هرگز نمی‌میریم.
من و تو با هزاران دگر،
این راه را دنبال می‌گیریم.
از آنِ ماست پیروزی.
از آنِ ماست فردا، با همه شادی و بهروزی.

عزیزم!
کار دنیا رو به آبادی‌ست.
و هر لاله که از خون شهیدان می‌دمد امروز،
نوید روز آزادی‌ست.

هوشنگ ابتهاج

I think that's pretty cool.

Vildemose said :NP's family members being in the Sepah

Well I think that's pretty cool.I was just reading what Saddat wrote about the Sepah's creation.

//iranian.com/main/blog/m-saadat-noury/first-iranian-figures-and-war-materials-history-iranian-army

I also admire her other family's religous history..(Not sure if I should say that but really who cares what I say anyway?)

While I'm at it,I think Sargords family history is very interesting as well.

جمشید عزیز؛

بدبختانه یا خوشبختانه، کار من تا اندازۀ زیادی از نظر مطالعاتی مرده خوریست.  تفاوت زیادی میان گذشته و حال نمی بینم اگرچه بازیگران صحنه اشخاص متفاوتی باشند.  در زمان محمد شاه قاجار، پدر ناصرالدین شاه، و زمان صدارت حاج میرزا آغاسی دولت انگلیس به ایران در بارۀ تجارت دریایی بردگان هشداری داد که ایشان این تجارت را در سطح جهانی ممنوع کرده اند و در خلیج فارس برعلیه آن وارد عمل می شوند. تعداد بردگان تجارت شده بنا برنوشته جرج عیساوی سالانه کمتر از دویست نفربوده است. دولت ایران هم به فرمان شاه که موجود است تجارت دریایی برده را ممنوع کرد. شاه گفت از خشکی بیاورند. اصولا، از نظر تاریخی نظام برده داری در آسیا و شرق به گسترده گی مغرب زمین نبوده است.  برای آن دلایل تاریخی واقتصادی و جامعه شناختی فراوانی وجود دارد؛ اگرچه نگاه ماتریایستی تاریخی بسیار تلاش کرد قالبهای غربی خودش را عینا به آسیا نیز تعمیم دهد.

دولت فخیمه به این بهانه نیروی دریایی خود را به خلیج اعزام کرد و از نیمه اول سده نوزده میلادی تا دهه هفتاد سده بیستم کنگر خوردند ولنگر انداختند و پیوسته تمامیت ارضی ایران را تهدید کردند تا جدایی کامل افغانستان محقق شد بی آن که تجارت برده ای در میان باشد.

  مسئله ما ارتباطی به رژیمهای خاص ندارد.  بدتر از تجارت برده چه میتواند باشد؟ نامی مقدس در خدمت هدفی شوم. هیچ گرگی نمی گوید من آمده ام تا ترا ببلعم.  جدا کردن حکومت ها از مردم بخشی از سرشت غرب است. تا چنین نکنند که حکومت و غارت نمی توانند بکنند. 

کاش خاطرات جنگت را نوشته بودی تا اقلا پیوند گذشته با حال را نشان می دادی.  نیازی به دفاع یا حمله به رژیم خاصی نیست.  اقلا آنهایی که آن روز ها را ندیدند ابتر و بی خبر نمانند که بجای آدمهای عینی دنبال اساطیر هالیوودی در میان ما بگردند. 

درود بر تو

I guess it was a simple

I guess it was a simple matter of personal safety and security being jeopardized. Let it go.

Vildemose or Samsam

Do you have a copy of that deleted post? Could you email it to me? Many thanks.

Benross you have an amazing

Benross you have an amazing ability to misread and misunderstand my posts.

That must be it! Anyway I didn't get to read his comment fully and when I came back, it was buried somewhere.

He had a comment to the point. About subject matter, unlike most of us that go subliminal. So if anybody should go somewhere else, it's not him. Whatever his idea is.

About being for or against ban, I simply believe common sense should prevail. This is not an off hand remark. We don't have a 'common sense'. If you have noticed, we don't even have a well established and well understood equivalent word in Persian for it. 

David

Good point. I noticed on that thread some very outrageous claims trying to paint the Greens as violent. The poster tried to tie them with MKO!! It is pathetic that some people will go to such extremes to bad mouth the Greens in order to whie wash the IRI crimes.

Others try to deflect the IRI crimes by bringing up all kinds of claims but missing the main thing: IRI is a military dictatorship that victimizes Iranians. Those of the people we need to worry about.