In-depth Experts Analysis On Secularism! (cartoon)

In-depth Experts Analysis On Secularism! (cartoon)
by Esfand Aashena
19-Dec-2011
 

میزگرد تخصصی جوامع دینی و چالش های سکولاریسم صبح امروز یکشنبه در موسسه پژوهشی حکمت و فلسفه ایران برگزار شد.

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Esfand Aashena

سکولاریسم بمن گفت چیگفت؟ خودش بمن گفت چیگفت؟ من از اسلام میترسم!

Esfand Aashena


Everything is sacred


Dr. Mohandes

Annahid

by Dr. Mohandes on

LOL...
Ahh...girl you are killing me. awsome. except we may wanna reword those last few words ... you know. You would not wanna too obvious..


Anahid Hojjati

Dr. Mohandes

by Anahid Hojjati on

Actually it is a good idea and the commercial can be, "benoosh Secula, bego marg bar Mullah".


Dr. Mohandes

Wish there was...

by Dr. Mohandes on

A cola named after secularism... Something Like Secular cola... Secula? 

It would have been much easier to Stic k it to the Public o allah!

MAybe i should email The big wigs at Cocaa colllaaa?... with my great idea...


Esfand Aashena

According to the Expert in this cartoon = Khamanei is a Saint!

by Esfand Aashena on

Everything is sacred


AMIR1973

Therefore Khamenei is not a Dictator

by AMIR1973 on

IRI, you see, is an "Islamic democracy". and the IRI's reformists are just trying to fine tune this Islamic democracy. Mousavi is the leader of Iran's reformist democracy movement, and the goal is to return to Emam's original principles of Islamic governance.


Esfand Aashena

Khamenei is not Secular!

by Esfand Aashena on

Everything is sacred


Roozbeh_Gilani

Khaamenei is secular! (estaghforollah!!!)

by Roozbeh_Gilani on

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."


Esfand Aashena

Dictators are all Secular!

by Esfand Aashena on

Everything is sacred


G. Rahmanian

Dear vildemose:

by G. Rahmanian on

What we are doing here on this site should be for Iran. That is the totality of a country with all its problems. At times, it seems like a rude awakening when you have to deal with defenders of the status quo who claim otherwise. To these entities audacity has become a character trait. Look at the way they attack any individual or organization that is fighting against the regime. They use every excuse to discredit the opposition forces. They write as if everyone in the opposition must pass their litmus test before they can even say a thing or two about the ruling Islamist criminals and their former lackies turned "opposition leaders." They tend to apply the test as if they themselves have been granted the mandate to judges and approve or disapprove others by the more than 70 million Iranians. Such entities deserve to be exposed "brutally!"


Esfand Aashena

Secularism means separation of Mosque and State with violence!

by Esfand Aashena on

Everything is sacred


vildemose

GR: thank you for being

by vildemose on

GR: thank you for being so  brutally honest. Alway spewing self-rightous declrations and full on hyporcrisy 24/7.

Albert Einstien: "Great Spirits will always encounter violent opposition from mediocre minds". This inspires me. More. "Whoever undertakes to set himself up as judge in the field of Truth and Knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the Gods".I don't deny anymajor religion except for the claims of exclusive truth. Truth is elusive. Those who claim to have it, typically lie.

 Information is the currency of democracy. ~Thomas Jefferson


Esfand Aashena

چالش سکولاریسم را در حقیقت گالش جمهوری اسلامی بوجود آورد!

Esfand Aashena


Everything is sacred


AMIR1973

Professor: Act the part and stop the personal attacks

by AMIR1973 on

It is unbecoming a professor to engage in so many personal attacks. Don't you know that? Perhaps personal attacks fill the void where logic, reason, and evidence would otherwise reside. It explains all the nonsense that you utter. I'll restrict myself merely to one of your nonsensical utterings:

Regardless of what you or anyone else of your type may think or wishes, Mousavi is hugely popular in Iran.  

I never said anything about Mousavi's supposed "popularity" or lack thereof (though the relative quiet after Mousavi's virtual house arrest stands in humiliating contrast -- humiliating, that is, if Islamists are capable of shame) to the ongoing uprising in Syria. The number of Iranians willing to risk life and limb for one of Emam's Khomeini's most loyal poodles, who wishes to return to the original roots of Emam's wonderful ideology, diminished very rapidly over time. But, if it's "popularity" you esteem, bear in mind that at no time has Mousavi's "popularity" approached anywhere near that of Mao, Mussolini, Hitler, Stalin, or even Emam himself (in 1979).


Mammad

The usual nonsense by the master rhetorician

by Mammad on

As usual, in your haste to throw mud, you did not even read what I said carefully.

1. First of all, what I said about the Shah was conditioned. I said, "Unless I misunderstand this grossly," meaning what kind of liberties are we talking about? Political/social, or what? The commentator must explain. Yes, there was social freedom during the Shah, but that was not what I was talking about.

2. Secondly, it is not the number of people executed that determines whether a regime is dictatorial or not, but the manner by which it rules. Reza Shah did not kill too many, but every objective historian, both Iranian and foreigner, agrees that his rule was absolutely dark and dictatorial. Same thing with his son. Even a simple-minded person understands this primitive concept, but you.

3. The comment by vildemose was about the rule of the Shah, on which I commented. Stick to the subject. But, then again, you cannot. You absolutely have nothing to say about the second part of my comment.

4. Regardless of what you or anyone else of your type may think or wishes, Mousavi is hugely popular in Iran. He called on people not to demonstrate; they did not. He called on them to demonstrate, they did. That is respect. That is credibility. That is popularity. So, it does not matter what your type thinks.

5. I have said many times, including this last comment that you used for your silly nonsense, that I support a secular democratic republic in which religion plays no role and clerics have no special privileges. I have also told you that you are nothing but someone who constantly wants to demonize Muslims and Islam, and you protested saying that you only refer to those who want to use Islam politically. By your definition, if it is sincere, I am not an Islamist. My religion is a private matter for me. Yet, you still refer to me as an "Islamist." You are nothing but a shallow, without substance demonizer. You contribute nothing to any debate, but uttering nonsense that has no basis in anything but in your skewed atomic-size brain.

Attack me as much as you want. Your ugly thoughts have been exposed once more, if it needed one more exposing. Many people before you, including your twin on this website, tried that, but gave up.

Mammad


AMIR1973

Islamist lines of argumentation....

by AMIR1973 on

So Iran, which during the 38-year reign of Moh'd Reza Pahlavi carried out several hundred executions, was a "total dictatorship" in that era, but Mousavi, during whose 8-year tenure as the IRI's prime minister at least 12,000 men, women, and children were executed (to use a very conservative estimate), is a leader of a "democratic movement". In the US, "extreme Christians basically control" one of the two major political parties, and yet when the presidency and both houses of Congress have been led by that party (of which I am NOT a supporter and NOT a member), the level of freedom of speech, press, assembly, and religion is infinitely greater than at any point during the 32 years of the Islamist terrorist regime (including the Golden Era of Emam and the wonderful 8 years of Khatami's "reforms").  


G. Rahmanian

Mammad:

by G. Rahmanian on

Demagoguery seems to be your forte! What the hell is "total dictatorship?" Secularim and religion's definitions are not clearcut? So, if 75% of the population of Iran is under the age of 35, does it mean they have not been influenced by their parents whose culture was fomed during the Shah's reign? To the chagrin of all Shite Islamists, the totalitarian Islamic rule of the the past three decades has turned the majority of Iranians against whatever looks, sounds or smells Islamic. What liberties under the Shah? Did you really ask that question? Then you have no idea what the word liberty means! I suggest you look it up! Shah was not a totalitarian ruler as you would like to imply. Iranians enjoyed many social and economic freedoms. This is not about the Shah's rule. This is about your charlatanism! You tend to resort to all sorts of misrepresentation of facts with the intention to mislead the readers. Go learn the true meanings of the terms before you write something on this site.


Mammad

Secularism-religion is not as clear cut as some believe

by Mammad on

1. The idea that, "Iran, after having decades of Westphalian concepts under the Shah, has a
population that understands that and the liberties it is missing," is absurd, unless I misunderstand it grossly. What liberties under the Shah? In addition, 75 percent of the population is under 35 years of age and has no memory of the Shah anyway. If the population understands the importance of private worship as opposed to government-sponsored, it is not because of the Pahlavis, but because of what the VF regime has done.

2. One also needs to look at what the West is doing in the Middle East to see whether the claim that "that is the battlefront drawn between Radical Islam of both major types
and the West: the ability of people to worship freely without State
interference," is actually true.

Just today, there was report that U.S.-Taliban negotiations are reaching turning point. Is Taliban not a radical form? Saudi Arabia, the land where the most radical interpretations of Islamic teachings emanate from - Salafism and Wahabism - which also represent the ideology of terrorist groups such as al-Qaeda, is firmly supported by the West. Rick Perry, the Republican candidate said the other way that there SA represents the "moderate Islam!" In Egypt the U.S. has reached an accomodation with Muslim Brotherhood. All the Arab Sheikhdoms of the Persian Gulf, from where many terrorists have come and practice radical forms, are firmly in the U.S. camp. The main opposition in Syria, supported by the West, consists of extreme Salafis and Sunnis [I am not implying that Syria is democracy or that it is not terrible; it is, but that one must look at these things more closely], supported by Saudi Arabia. Turki al-Faisal of Saudi Arabia refers to the Arab Springs as Arab troubles!

The West does not give a hoot to liberty for the people of the Islamic world. What it cares about is having regimes there that protect its interests.

4. As a practicing Muslim I believe in separation of church and state. But, claiming that secularism solves all of our problems is at best naivete and ignorance at worst. Iran under the Shah and his father had a secular political system, which was however total dictatorship. Here, in the United States, the extreme Christians basically control the Republican Party, and in fact the separation of church and state is an important issue. Extremist Jews - the type that wants to expell Palestinians from their lands - are a powerful force in Israel.

So, it is not as clear cut as some believe. 

Mammad


آشنا

علوم غربیه و بی خدایی

آشنا


"سولفات دو پتاس یعنی خدا دوتاس" "سولفات دو سود یعنی خدا اصلاً نبود" این ها را از خودم در نیاورده ام. دو جمله بالا واقعا گفته شده. اینجاست:

http://yaad-e-ayyam.persianblog.ir/1381/10/

http://www.bbc.co.uk/persian/iran/story/2005/08/050802_mj-shahr-e-khoda1.shtml

http://www.rahetudeh.com/rahetude/2011/07june/4/tarikh.html


Esfand Aashena

Secularism is the Devil!

by Esfand Aashena on

Rea, you naughty naughty!  Santa is not good to the naughty ones!  No soup for you this Christmas! 

Everything is sacred


Rea

Here's my caption

by Rea on

Xmas special.

Maria Magdalena and the wild bunch.

http://www.google.fr/imgres?q=7+dwarves&hl=fr&sa=X...


Esfand Aashena

Secularism is like a bastard child!

by Esfand Aashena on

Vildemose you need to take a chil pill and take my posts in this blog with a grain of salt, or in your case with a boat load of salt!   

Everything is sacred


Roozbeh_Gilani

hottest topic on i.com maybe...

by Roozbeh_Gilani on

but not at the villages of Gilan, where there are about 1 emaamzaadeh /100 population! 

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."


vildemose

Bunch of religious hacks

by vildemose on

 Esfand Ashena:

Hands down your last post gets the prize for dumbest poster ever...I just marvel at your  illiteracy. You neither understand Secularim or Communism...I shouldn't be surprised though, most reformers are ideologue hacks...

 The difference between evidence-based theories and hackish ones, however, is the part about being evidence-based. Any well-read student of political history  will hungrily examine the real world results of their theories and  implementations of it,  if necessary, adapt their thinking in line with the evidence. Ideologues, however, will not, and that is the prime definition of a hack: someone whose theories never hold up to real world scrutiny or practice, but who nonetheless still vows in their efficacy because, damn it, it behooves them to do so.

"Information is the currency of democracy. ~Thomas Jefferson


default

The same way Shah and the US were #1 topic for Iranians in 1979

by Hooshang Tarreh-Gol on

Back then, we all thought: if only Shah would go away all problems will be solved and Iran will be heaven.

Now we think: if only Iran becomes secular, all the problems will be solved and Iran will be turned into heaven.

What's wrong with our over-simplified national thinking?


Esfand Aashena

Secularism is the number one and hottest topic on i.com!

by Esfand Aashena on

Everything is sacred


Roozbeh_Gilani

بابا اصلا گور پدر سکولریسم،

Roozbeh_Gilani


حالا که حضرت رهبر تپل مپل، کیم کون جون به درک (به بخشید بهشت برین) واصل شد، این موشک‌های دندون شکن امپریالیسمو از کجا بخریم؟


vildemose

 Iran, after having

by vildemose on

 Iran, after having decades of Westphalian concepts under the Shah, has a population that understands that and the liberties it is missing. That is the battlefront drawn between Radical Islam of both major types and the West: the ability of people to worship freely without State interference. The Radical forms of Islam do not abide by that and so must bring down the Nationalist system regardless of its place or outlook.

That is the *other* for them, their great Anathema: letting people have sanctity of self to *choose* religious outlook and not have the State decide for them.

Look at the bloody history of the Germanic Principalities on that issue and one can see the world that this would bring about. It is sad to think that nearly 360 years from Westphalia the world is now to be plunged into that cauldron *again*. That is what the threat is because this Other... this freedom of personal decision and sanctity in it, is so abominable to those wanting religious tyranny, that they cannot abide by it. And if we who enjoy Freedom of Religious Choice cannot fight this, then the death toll will be astronimically high compared to all the 20th century wars *combined*. We can fight and limit that carnage... or succumb to it and be back just where the world was those centuries ago.

 

Information is the currency of democracy. ~Thomas Jefferson


Esfand Aashena

Secularism is in essence Western Communism!

by Esfand Aashena on

BTW the spelling of the word IS is wrong!  When the blog drops from being featured I'll correct the spelling in the title! 

Everything is sacred


default

Ma Raftani hasteem....

by darius on

Ma bel akhare raftani hasteem, ama tarikhe  Iran hichvagt farmoosh nakhad kard ke ma  ye mosht bach tolab ke faghat mitoonesteem darbare jalgh zadan bahse or mobahese koneem, you mosht bache sosool tahseelkarde kharj  va ye mosht  chereek haye taelim deede in libi, cheen va felstine ro sare jashoon neshoondeem. Yadeshoon bashe toye k...h hamashoon gozasteem va hanooz ke hanooze dard ajazeh dorost fekr kardan ro beheshoon nemide.  "  We are aware that we know longer can hold to power but History  will never forget that we , " bach tolabs/ seminaries " that our best discussion wouldn't go further that masturbation , brought a bunch of so called  eduacted   and  trained gurillas in libya, Palestine and china down to their knees . We screwed them so hard that pain still hasn't gone away and won't let them to recover from  the confusion.A lesson that should never forget.