Persian Realm

Your comments Rea

I deal with facts, not emotions like you. And let me tell you that it is all too easy to be seduced by decorative blogs by people who will use anything to satisfy their own agendas. Sadly you are in the habit of making empty emotional statements and then backtracking. Your comment says absolutely nothing.

TS

Honey, do not pull Hague justice on me, doesn't work, am only too familiar with it.

Islam's surrender was negotiated 2 months ago, the only way for him to survive. I have nothing against him being "captured", it's the way it is being presented I don't like.

Btw, if you have ever lived in the Middle East, you woud've known a bit about honour of these people. No way one can justify this humiliation.

I disagree Rea Jan

You cannot hold the entire nation responsible for the behavior of a minor few who caught Gaddafi and put him to death very much like the way Italian Mobs took vengeance on Mussolini after the War.

Benito Mussolini is Executed.

The Libyans had to fight for their survival in what was more than merely a Revolution against a mild dictator ( as was the case for Tunisia, or Egypt). The Syrians are being suppressed by Bachar Assad today in a very similar way while the Russian Leaders are spilling crocodile tears for Bachar and less for the people being suppressed.

At the time of the Battle of Syrth how many "moralists" were expressing outrage for the hundreds of deaths inflicted on the rebels by Gaddafi's Snipers for each vain assualt on their Stronghold ?

This is a price Gaddafi paid due to his own intransigent behavior despite several attempts and mediations offered to Gaddafi to give up power and even leave the country which he systematically refused.

Trust Me Gaddafi Sodomized Libyans more than their due for the past 42 years through his own network of bloody henchmen.

I would have preferred to see him put on trial but he got the death he ultimately provoked by his own stubborn behavior.

I would not like to see his son be treated similarly and arbitrarily and hope that he will be delivered to the International Court of Justice in La Hague.

But Libya is in a chaotic phase of transition as could be expected after their bloody struggle for freedom and the chains of command in a country where everyone is armed to the teeth is very vague at this juncture.

It's not the White Collars of the National Transitional Council who can merely order people with Guns around. That will take time and patience and cannot be achieved overnight.

But to judge the Libyans from our High Horse as if we were more "civilized" is no different from how Colonialists looked down at Native people they had conquered or how White Americans looked down at American Indians as a bunch of Savages.

Sorry but I even find the way some in the West try to lecture the Libyans on the Charia nothing short of that Colonialist intellectual arrogance which ultimately triggered the Anti Colonialist movements of the 19th and 20th Century.

We cannot impose on a nation and people OUR Set of Values as if they were Universal.

We can only try to help them see the light and guide them through advice and some form of political pressure on their leadership to respect a minimum of rules and principles during this period of transition.

Before even hoping to have a democracy, a responsible transitional government of a country like Libya needs to first and foremost meet the needs of the people in terms of security and daily needs and get the economy going.

That requires time and political unity.

By merely criticizing and crippling the Transitional Government from our safe Havens as if all this was so simple I doubt we will be helping them achieve their long term goals.

But to blame the Libyans entirely for the violence that Gaddafi and his henchmen may or may not be subject to is not fair.

Saif al-Islam was no innocent either ...

He is not responsible for being his father's son but he is for his personal behavior during the conflict and endorsing the "rivers of blood" speech of his father by delivering an equally chilling interview "Our Plan A, Plan B, Plan C" which prolonged the conflict to far more bloody proportions.

This family behaved like a clan of wild wolves and now they are caught like the same wild animals they were.

I said from the very beginning of this conflict that had Obama attacked Gaddafi at the very first week of his crackdown on the Libyans protesting peacefully, Gaddafi would have been eliminated in a national upheaval in a matter of days with far less blood and collateral damages. Instead Obama chickened out and allowed Gaddafi to get back even more horrendously at all those who opposed him by committing massacres in Misrata and other towns. 

Obama gave Gaddafi a second Chance very much like a Hunter would give a Wounded Wolf a second chance to come back and bite him hard.

Had Obama behaved otherwise we would not have had a month delay which allowed Gaddafi to organize himself and hit back hard. Not only that we would certainly not have see the so called Arab Spring turn into the bloody Summer it has become since.

The events in Syria, Bahrain or Yemen may have been contained and forced these leaders to make concessions by Fear of an American President ready to side with the People.

Instead of having the first Afro American PResident rush to the rescue of African "natives" which could have turned him into a real hero and not this undeserving Nobel Peace Prize Laureate he has become since.

American values would have been also seen as a role model for all people in the region.

Instead it is a French Right Wing Warmonger President who came to their rescue and France is today perceived by many in the Arab world and North Africa as a reliable partner.  

All this to say that blaming the Libyans for being "savages" is a cheap shot knowing how little people were willing to lift a finger for them in the most terrible hours of this conflict.

I don't endorse vengeance or killings of Gaddafi's supporters by the rebels in anyway whatsoever But personally I won't throw them the first stone for such collateral damages and however unfortunate that may be from our "civilized" point of view.

I hope Saif Al Islam will be treated well and tried by an independent court and I even salute his courage in the face of adversity but I will not spill crocodile tears for his predicament. 

bombing and shooting of civilian protesters in February

Three judges will examine evidence linking Saif al-Islam to the bombing and shooting of civilian protesters in February

//www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/oct/28/icc-saif-islam-order-fire?newsfeed=true 

Perhaps find out background to warrant against him

He is not being held responsible for his fathers sins. I know it is fashionable to protest against protesters these days and to appease ones friends on this site , but at least find out what you are talking about before commenting.

//www.haguejusticeportal.net/eCache/DEF/12/803.html 

Is this the reason why he is portrayed as he is on this blog? The word "Heir"?

‎

"Seif al-Islam was indeed his father’s son.

In a televised address five days after anti-government protests broke out in the eastern city of Benghazi as part of the wider Arab Spring uprising, a haggard-looking Seif al-Islam warned of “rivers of blood” if demonstrators refused to accept government offers of reform."  

Hope, will not read tomorrow

... that he also has been sodomised prior to being killed.

If anything, am disgusted by these so called freedom fighters.

Shame on Libyans

.... shame on those counting betrayal $.

No son is to be held responsible for his father's sins.

'Gaddafi's son captured' in Libya

'Gaddafi's son captured' in Libya (bbc)

Colonel Gaddafi's son Saif al-Islam has been captured, officials from Libya's interim government have said.

Saif al-Islam was arrested near the town of Obari in the south of the country, the officials said.

The former leader's son would be the last key member of the Gaddafi family to be captured or killed.

Saif al-Islam is wanted by the International Criminal Court for alleged crimes against humanity during the uprising against his father.

The National Transitional Council's justice minister Mohammed al-Allagui said Saif al-Islam had been detained along with a number of bodyguards, Reuters news agency reported.

Officials said Saif al-Islam had been taken to the city of Zintan in the north of the country.

Gaddafi's son was in good health, the justice minister is reported to have said.

A commander of the Zintan brigades, allied to the NTC, told a news conference that Saif al-Islam was captured as aides were trying to smuggle him out to neighbouring Niger, the Associated Press news agency reported.

The former leader's son has been on the run since NTC forces took the capital, Tripoli, in August. 

Gaddafi 'buried in Libya desert'

Gaddafi 'buried in Libya desert' (bbc)

Kingdom of Libya: Bikinis, Alcohol & Rockn' roll (PHOTOS)

Pictures of 1960s Libya: Cosmopolitan Life Before Gaddafi | LightBox | TIME.com

Not very different from Shah's Era ...

pictory: Girls in Bikini vs Veiled Women on Caspian Sea, Babolsar (1971) 

Also ...

Libya’s Co Queen of Egyptian Heritage without Veil

She was Co-Queen of Libya for just under three years, Alia Abdel Kader Lamloum a daughter and granddaughter of distinguished Egyptian Bedouin notables of Libyan origin married 5 June 1955 and divorced 27 April 1958

U.S.military official appears alongside King Idris  (in traditional costume) and his wife ( Not at all veiled).( Source Foreign Policy)

Sharia Inexistent under the Monarchy is product of Gaddafi's era

Sharia was virtually Inexistent under the Monarchy at worst mildly applied and is a product of Gaddafi's era

Legislation ...

See Below:

Law under the federal monarchy

In the 1950s under King Idris, completely new codes based on French and Italian civil law were drafted, including the Commercial Code of 1953 and the Civil Code of 1954.[1] The latter was written by Abd El-Razzak El-Sanhuri, the author of the 1948 Egyptian Civil Code, which itself was based on the French civil law, but also recognised sharia and Arab customs as a source of law.[4][5] Arab customs were ranked by Article I of the Libyan code as third as a source of law in Libya, behind sharia; this compares to its ranking of second, ahead of sharia, in other countries adopting Sanhuri codes such as Egypt and Iraq.[6] European laws were imported and applied in fields where sharia law was less developed, namely commercial law, procedural law, and penal law.[7] Islamic influence remained in some areas of commercial law too, however; Libya was the first country adopting the Sanhuri code to prohibit riba (usury).[8]
Libya maintained a dual system of courts during this period: sharia law, of the Maliki school, was applied by sharia courts in matters of personal status. However, the establishment of this system of dual courts in practise meant power was taken away from the traditional sharia courts, leading to a backlash and the growth of Islamic opposition movements.

More here:

Law of Libya - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia 

Libya to adopt Sharia law,

//timesofindia.indiatimes.com/world/middle-east/Libya-to-adopt-Sharia-law-ends-public-showing-of-Gaddafis-body/articleshow/10478689.cms

"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both." - Louis D. Brandeis