RELATIONSHIPS

So Why Haven't You Married him yet?

HAHAHAHAHA
May be the reason Irani guys ask you this question is that when a good Irani girl is serious about a man she doesn't go around drinking, then talking or flirting with total strangers at parties. Good Irani girls who are seriously involved are a bit more resreved and they don't put themselves in awkward situations with single guys.
And when you mention the fact that you are "serious" about some guy to "another" guy whom you're talking to, what does that mean? That you're only showing him the apple but telling him he can't bite?
If you're trying to be French then stay in France, that's where most French people stay :) and when, by accident, you meet an Iranian guy either ignor him or tell him you're married, so you don't have to explain your Frenchness!

All i'm going to say is that

All i'm going to say is that more often than not, iranians have been nothing but a social pain in the ass. My own family excluded, due to me being lucky to be born into a normal family, but the majoirty of iranians i've ever met have had a gigantic fucking chip on their shoulders about every little thing. Life seems to be a constant contest between persians, and i honestly can't stand it at all. Everything is too formal in iran, yet nothing is formal in a way that matters. Everything is halfassed unless it has to do with someones personal bloated ego.

All i can say is thank god I live in canada.

Don't talk this way about your people, please.

Shame on you vatan kosha who talk about your countryfolk in a negative way.

We have ENOUGH problems as it is, especially with the rest of the world looking at us askance, that here we are figuratively killing each other??

This does nothing for our future besides jeopardize it.

Really, money isn't the only thing to judge someone one, honest! Other ethnic groups go to hell and back for their own, and he we are judging people on their cars, homes, and designer clothes???????????

Ajeebeh hah!

There's nothing "wrong" with Iranians, the problem is YOU and your nejad kosh ways!

The Boyfriends View

If you read all this comments here you can clearly see that the people either talk in a cultured, pleasant way and bring across their point (no matter if its approval or criticism), or they go crazy with insults like a kid who’s ice cream was stolen... To the second kind I can just say grow up and learn: the louder you shout the less people will listen. Try to live up to the high expectations, due to your cultural heritage.

This article is not suppose to be a highly scientific analysis were you can say 65.5% of all Iranian guys are jerks. No, its suppose to draw a picture of one type of guys and having a good laugh at them. Its to pinpoint some characteristics of your culture and talk about it. I think we are all old enough to know that not all people from one country can be the same and you should not expect to say that every time when you write an sarcastic humorous article. And seriously, were would be the fun in that?

What have I read about an identity crisis and all this stuff? It's funny how people think that they know how a person is like, after reading one and a half pages of text! Is Stephen King a paranoid maniac just because he writes horror stories? Do we have to be always 100% honest, politically correct and always say what we really mean?
And that is exactly what Bita is complaining about in her article. People that think they know you better then you know yourself and try to tell you how to live your life, all based on whether you live with your boyfriend or not, or like here, on the base of roughly 800 words written to make people laugh...

Just one final word, learn to get sarcasm and learn to not go crazy when someone says 'the Iranians'. Lean back, think and then open your mouth. If I would go nuts every time I hear about 'the Germans' and what we are supposed to be like it would be a fulltime job.

Take it easy,
Torben

take it easy, he was just

take it easy, he was just conversing...why be at a party or bar talking to a guy for a while and then bring up that you have a boyfriend anyway? girls are always saying that guys are just after one thing...and it's true, so why act so surprised? if a girl comes and talks to me while drunk at a party, i'll assume she's interested. if she then mentions she has a boyfriend after talking to me for all that time, i'll probably assume she's playing hard to get too.

or just stop getting wasted and talking to guys at parties since you're in such a serious relationship...

Iranian guys do have a stick in the ass

i personally think the comments are much biased considering most of the respondents are men, iranian men do have a stick in the ass.

http://www.iranian.com/SiamackBaniameri/2007/Janua...

chillout

chill out guys, you're taking yourselves too seriously. I don't hate iranians, I wasn't even all that drunk when i went to the party, i didn't even meet any iranians, it wasn't an iranian party. it was just a made up story to cause a bit of controversy here. which i think it did.

like i said it was just a story and i was just having a bit of fun. Quite frankly i will continue to write whatever i want (as i always have) and you don't have to read it! so far you guys (who took this seriously) are the suckers for spending so much time discussing my a semi fictional piece, I'm flattered.

I am not up to speed on all of the conversation but one thing

I would like to say, is that just reading articles posted by Iranians and other nationalities which have a linkage to Iran either through marriage (like Chicago Dad), or because of their passion for Iran, and reading and posting comments has made me enjoy iranian.com more than another other web-site.

We argue, we disagree with each other, but we also laugh and joke with one another; we share our ideas, our thoughts and our memories; and we may at times make some nasty remarks but we never take it personally.

Iranians have a fantastic sense of humour, they can be serious, but also funny, they are engaging, exceptionally kind, very compassionate and definitely never boring!

When one commentator said, I don't know what being Iranian means anymore; I would like to say that it has nothing to do with how long we have lived outside of Iran; there is so much that we have in common.

More importantly in our hearts we know that we have a deep bonding with one another; something that is unexplainable in words and nothing can replace this!

We are all members of one big family, and this is the best feeling that one can get; you know you are never alone! And any non-Iranian who joins this website can very easily assimilate with us - this says alot about Iranians.

I came on line to see if

I came on line to see if anyone is turning their light off for earth day (or whatever it's supposed to be) and I see that there are 61 comments on this article. 20 + since I last checked. I was sure bita had made an appearance! WOW..khanum khoshgel jan, sista, you missed the point. No one here commented on your style of writing. Sarcastic or not. You came here saying Iranians are nasty and that you hate Iranians. Sheesh. That's what people have been talking about. I know varjavand is very right but I for one am so glad I'm Iranian with a stick in my bum bum. It's so much better than having 2 sticks in my ears and eye patches on my eyes. A mouth by itself doesn't help. Even if one is writing a thesis. None of the comments I managed to read yesterday had any real criticism of the live in situation. They all made comments about identity crisis. Any mention of your relationship was in passing and in order to make a bigger point. Vah vah bita jan, sit down, have a cup of water and reread the comments. Shayad dozarit biofteh. Good luck with your relationship and thesis. Movafagh bashi. When you decide to accept youreslf and stop hating yourself and background...we'll take you back. We always do.

People: leave the ugly comments out. don't be childish. peeleez (bita cover your ears my accent might offend you)

Rest Easy

Dear All,

My life has been so unbearable since I read Bita’s article. Do you know how agonizing it has been to wake up every morning not knowing whether her boyfriend is Iranian or Indian, whether she intends to marry her boyfriend, whether she look prettier than her photo, whether her boobs are real or implants!! 

Now that she answered most of these questions and enlightened us by clarifying all the disputed issues, I can rest more comfortably. I t was a mountain lifted off my chest! We can now turn our attention to less important issues such as: global warming, Iran’s nuclear stand off, escalating cost of living, crime, war and terrorism, health and education, poverty and diseases, distressing economic recession, Etc.

Cheers,Varjavand

IT'S JUST YOU

You start of with this sentence:

"Is it just me or do Iranians have a huge stick shoved in their ass?"

The answer is:
IT'S JUST YOU.

That's all folks!

Dear Chicago Dad

Dear Chicago Dad,
Bravo!
Bravo for being who you are and for having the mindset that you have!
(have read most, perhaps all that you have written on this site)
Sincerely wish there were millions more of you,
that would truly make this world a better place!
Best,
Nina

To: Bita Ria

It is good you mentioned freedom of choice since I did not catch it anywhere in your writing. I wouldn't have caught it even if you put it in bold face letters!

All I got from reading your article is that a few shots of Vodka and a casual conversation with some Iranian guy sparked off a treatise on how terrible the Iranians are. And of course what a cool, hip, modern intellectual woman YOU ARE.

There is one good Iranian recipe for 'aragh khori' or drinking as it is refered to in Melbourn, after every shot a spoonful of yogurt (preferably MastoKhiar) and a large glass of ice water before you go to bed. That will help get the razor sharp edge off your writings.

And by the way, when are you going to marry the guy you are living with? Keep us posted and until then Ta Ta and Cheers.

To: Bita Ria

Thank you for your comment, but really you and I are not kindred spirits.  I do not think that you displayed a lot of discretion in writing the things you wrote.  I guess freedom of speech allows people to write and say things that are not going to endear them to others though.  The reason I spoke up at all is because I do not think anything you wrote warrented you being called a "Melbourne slut."  No Iranian woman deserves to be called such names merely for expressing opinions that are unpopular with and repulisve to others.  Without intending to be preachy, I urge you to put much more thought into what you write before you write it.  Otherwise, you might wake up someday and find that you have no Iranian friends left.  Your situation now and my wife's situation thirty years ago are in no way similar.  She was belittled and insulted by her hamvatan only for wanting to be with me.  In contrast, you have been belittled and insulted as a result of and in response to your own inflamatory words.  Iranians are a very patient people, but their patience does have limits. 

Peace,

CD 

Slut Vs Patriarcal iranian men

to anonymous[somenumbers], you, i call patriarchal. Refer to my article on 'Swearing rappers':
http://www.iranian.com/Bita/2007/June/Rap/index.ht...

"...Men dare to call women sluts for expressing their sexuality, they judge us for having premarital sex but..."

change your attitude, it's for people like you that we have problems in iran.

my stuff

i write in two very different styles, either really serious with facts etc or total sarcastic sinister humor (which only a small group of people get). you can check out my other stuff here:

http://www.iranian.com/bita.html

you'll notice i've got other stuff similar to this one. It's just for a bit of fun (and i involve anyone, even my mum whom i love) just like one of the comments said.

i'm not going to tell you what i REALLY think because i've left this one for my thesis!

cheers all.

to chicagodad on 'My Iranian Slut'

chicagodad, i sent you a comment which i forgot to send publicly, and so i want to thank you for sharing your story. It is very touching. We have something in common and that my partner isn't Iranian either, he is german.

he really loves me, and has always been there for me. I don't know why some iranian guys on this forum implied that i have an indian boyfriend? i don't, not that there is anything wrong with having an indian boyfriend.

We've got a story too, may be i'll write about it to iranian.com oneday :)

to ZanAmrikai - the only one who got the point!

to zan amrikai who is the only one on this forum who got the point to the story! it was just for a bit of fun and i can't believe you guys took it so seriously.

it's the style i write it, you should read my story on 'whiskey and coke' - imaginary story of going to a party in tehran, i wrote it when i was in tehran, totally bored out of my brains.

to 'the real nader vanaki'

"if some european dude or American guy had asked you the same question you would have flirted with him all night long."

I think you are a little slow because you've attempted to get me worked up by using the word 'flirt', considering i said in my story that i have a boyfriend and that i'm committed to him.

i don't think it is acceptable that anyone questions one's freedom of choice! and that i should marry my boyfriend if i love him. for the sake of the reply to your silly question, an Australian guy once told me that i should marry my boyfriend otherwise it's not serious and i told him he's out of line. With iranians i tolerate it because i know where they're coming from.

I think that is a very traditional mindset to own, we live in the 21st century, you can't force people to conform and be uniform, otherwise go and live in the theocratic iran so you have a "marja-e-taghlid".

to chicagodad and others

thank you. I think i need to write a reply to all the replies, but quite frankly none of the comments people gave bothered or flattered me.

I don't think people realised but the story was written with purposeful sinisterism and sarcasm, it seems to be the style that gets people most and thus i've achieved my goal.

quite frankly i don't know what made 'bored dude' think that i have a low self-confidence, i don't think so, but okay if you must insist. i'm glad i was the topic of your discussion with your friends, i can definitely sell some books one day ;)

my partner whom i live (not leave hahaa) with loves me and i love him dearly and we intend on marrying some day.

Someone said I must be ugly that's why i don't have friends ?!! i thought it was a very childish thing to say, it clearly proves some of my points about some iranians.

Furthermore to that, i'm not ugly (i'm guessing you're basing this on my writer's thumnail? i agree it's not a very good photo!), even if i was i don't think people should be making friends based on how they look !!

chicagodad your points were very touching and thank you for sharing it with us :)

cheers all.
b

Take a Look In The Mirror!!

Ms. Bita,

I read your article until I was bored…...actually, the boredom started immediately after I began reading your article...but here are a few comments that I think you will benefit from:

First, you seem to be suffering from a bit of narcissism. Tow thirds of this article was about who (or what) YOU are. I'm a bit funny...I'm a bit this...and a bit that...Frankly, my dear,: WHO CARES?!!! Have you ever thought that this self-absorption of yours is the reason why Iranians don't want to hang out with you? We, as Iranians, value humility more than anything else. We have a saying in Persian" "taarif as khod kardan goh khordan ast"... perhaps that's the reason why Iranians don't want to hear you yap about yourself at parties...so, next time you're at an Iranian gathering try to ask other people about THEIR lives and interests before you open your pie hole and start talking about yourself and your lovely and talented Sanjay Gupta!!! I promise you that you will make more friends.

Second, I am an Iranian guy, and I do not give a rat's ass who you live with. You can live with a goat as far as I'm concerned!!!

Third, stop stereotyping us. I have lived outside of Iran most of my life. But I find that Iranians are some of the most decent people to interact with both on personal and professional level.

Lastly, Iranian guys generally have a sophisticated taste in women, and judging by your photo...well, let's not go there!!!

RE: Bita

"I've written more on my love for iranians, particularly iranian guys ;) check it out:

http://www.iranian.com/bita.html

to everyone else, thank you for all your comments i loved reading your feedbacks :) keep them coming!"

Yes I know you have, sadly. Neither me (Iranian), nor my Iranian gf, my Iranian brother, my English co worker, my Indian buddy who have also gone through this crap you wrote while we were having some wine feel the way you do. You should be honoured that you were the topic of our discussion over dinner for measly 5 minutes. Our conclusion was this: You are a sad bitter person honestly, and most likely going to have a serious identity crisis break down when you get dumped again, and get "touched" at a random Metro station.

Thats what your proving when you write generalizing stuff like this where you judge people by your own small pathetique experiences, the lack of your own self confidence, nothing more (Rascism and Discrimination is buildt on this logic). Anyone else on this board who try to lick your ass by trying to give neutral or positive comments on this garbage, or try to even take this shit as serious cultural critique (which by all means is healthy, when its serious), are most likely having the same issues.

My brother, last year studying psycology, read your title alone and said you need help, and you do Bita. You do need help. Take that as an advice, not as an offence.

Now back to my lunch, good luck!

Too much expectation!

"I am an Iranian who has a family here but leaves with her boyfriend"...lol i know it was a typo but im one of those pain-in-the-ass guys who likes to point funny things out heehee.

Alright first i like to say hello and give a big hug to chicagodad user who is an exceptional american, i very much liked the way you responded to the guy who called bita a slut. so a big thank you goes to you.

Alright now for the feedback to roya. its not just the guys...there have been many many occasions when i have tried to be just friendly to an iranian girl and she just couldnt get that i only want to have a friendly chat and not get bored without wanting to ask her out or marry her. so yeah!!

I have thought about this whole notion of meeting iranians and getting dissapointed over and over alot but at the end i found the answer:

1. when we meet ANY iranian outside iran we have this "foozool bazi" which translates into being nosey attitude to go talk to him/her or make conversation blah blah.

2. Now by meeting a new iranian your thinking heeey i met an iranian he/she must be cool/friend/crazy like me but the fact of the matter is we all have good/bad friendly/uptight people in out community. you dont have to like everyone and not everyone has to like you.. DEAL WITH IT!

3. I personally dont drink and yeah go ahead and call me basiji like that would realllllly hurt me lol, anyway but as you repeatedly mentioned you were pretty drunk. I dont tend to conversate with girls who are drunk and i have little respect for "iranian girls" you are pretty drunk. I know it is Clice to expect more from our own people but i simply think Iranian people tend to handle themselves better and not make a fool out of themselves in Bars/Clubs and whenever i see such acts i deeply get dissapointed but again if that person is in need i would help them. cause again we all have good/bad days so maybe he/she wanted to get drunk and forget about her/his pain but to me being drunk and acting silly specially by iranian women is not acceptable, call me old fashioned but i have some "gheyrat" over my people. ( not sure what gheyrat translates into english)

4. Live and let live. I personally dont like it when a not so attractive girl smiles at me and tries to have a chat with me in a bar specially if im in a bar/club im there to get hooked up. fine i will chat to her etc but i will try to finish the conversation quickly so i go do my thang and do my thang ;). Im not calling bita ugly im just saying maybe those International student dont find you attractive enough to actually wanting to be your friend and yes we iranian do care about looks and well nothing wrong with that everyone to some extend is like that.

I like to finish by saying dont look at the glass half empty but half full, expect less from your own countrymen and you will always get more its when you expect ALOT just cause they are "Irooni" is when you get dissapointed.

p.s) drink sensibly!! lol

Identity (politics) is/can be a multi-faceted sword

There is a fabulous lecture about 'identity' by Nobel laureate Professor Amartya Sen.

If you care to have a look and listen it's on google video. Title of the first lecture is "Identity and Violence: The Violence of Illusion". The second lecture gives a hopeful guideline " Identity and Violence: Making Sense of Identity"
(I'm too techno-challenged for links)

Personally, I try to be aware of what I have been given at birth and what I am un/sub/consciously assimilating in order to 'act'. One-dimensional classifications such as nationality, ethnicity etc, just don't appeal to me.

Bita, please remember that it is "In PRIMO vino veritas" not on a vodka overdose, but have fun.
Perhaps the guy just wanted to make conversation? I don't know, I wasn't there and can't judge. (Don't know you either....)

'Have fun

Marjan

> Identity crisis

This whole issue has a name : Identity Crisis. Iranians are vey much at risk nowadays.

Ghorban e shoma

It is so sad

It is truely sad to learn that many Iranians in this thread obviously  have a poor taste for choosing their Iranian aquaintances.

It seems to me that because of their own poor taste, they are attracted to the jerk types, and then they complain why everyone is a jerk.

There are Iranian jerks out there, I know. But for each of them there is a decent Iranian too. It is so for any nationality. 

To those folks, including Bita, I have only one thing to say: I feel sorry that you have not yet met a decent Iranian man or woman, I am talking about the kind that with only their pure Iranian "maraam" can cast such a spell on your hearts that you could never find it in yourself to describe Iranians as you did in here.

Wish you better luck with the people you meet in the future.

Break another cliche !

Bita 

I have read your story a few times since yeaterday and now I am ready to say something to you becuase that is what you have asked for.

Firstly I really think that you like many Iranians raised outside of Iran are struggling with your identity. This is not so suprising. The conflicts between needing to fit in with where ever you live and retaining your cultural background/values/ identity are many.

Bita you describe yourself as a 'cliche breaker' ... so break another one and stop giving iranians a hard time for trying to manage the best they can with the same struggle that you do. You can call yourself 'humanitarian, an ultra friendly saint' if that makes you happy to think about yourself in this way.. All i know is that none of us have the right to make such judgements and assumptions about each other what ever our gender, age, social status or ethnicity,especially when we meet someone for the first time at a party under the influence of alcohol. We are likely to only see a snap shot of who they are and what has been their experience of life.

Bita janam ... live and let live,  try not  make such generalisations because you will find yourself lonely. Be generous in your thoughts to other Iranians, many have suffered and lost much in their lives. Talk to them instead, find out what it is that makes them who they are. You will be happier in your life.

I wish you well.

Javaneh

To: Anonymous45654654

Dear Anonymous45645654,

I noticed that you called bita_ria a slut. Don't you think that is a bit harsh? Maybe not. Let me tell you about my Iranian slut if you will.

Long ago, when I was dating my now wife a group of young Iranian men who lived in her apartment building called her a slut because she had the audasity to date someone who was not an Iranian. Maybe they were right to call her that. Perhaps, it has a different meaning in your culture than in America because she has been a wonderful patner for me. Let me recount a few of the ways she has sweetened and enriched my life:

1. My Iranian slut has been my lover, best friend and partner in life for over thirty years.

2. My Iranian slut married me when I had nothing to give her except promises of a brighter future.

3. My Iranian slut asked for only $1 and a Holy Quran from me as a Mahr (marriage gift) because she knew I wasn't wealthy at the time.

4. Over the years as my bank account grew fat, my Iranian slut was always on my accounts and could have cleaned them out at any time if she had wanted to, but...she did not.

5. My Iranian slut introduced me to a world I would have never known if I had never met her. I have been blessed beyond measure learning of Persian/Iranian culture, eating Persian food, and listening to Persian music over the past three decades.

6. My Iranian slut held my hand and nursed me back to health when I battled cancer a few years back. I know if there comes a day that I must face that battle again, my Iranian slut will be by my side through thick and through thin.

7. My Iranian slut gave me a beautiful son whom we loved dearly. She always told me that children were only temporary gifts from God and one day they grow up and move away. What she didn't realise is that sometimes God takes them away permanently to their eternal home in Heaven. This is what happened to us last year. My Iranian slut is broken hearted, but like a true Shir Zan, she has helped me, as I have her, to pick ourselves up again and move forward in life.

8. I know no matter what happens to me in life, my Iranian slut will always be by my side and will always support me. Either I will one day be the one to bury my slut, or she will be the one to bury me, but to the end I know that my Iranian slut and I will always be together.

9. There has not passed one day since I met my Iranian slut that I have not loved her with all my heart, but more importantly;

10. I know that there hasn't passed a day in her life since we first met that my Iranian slut has not loved me absolutely.

I regard your very nasty and insulting comment to bita_ria to be a badge of honor. If some man is lucky enough one day call her his wife, then you my friend will be just as correct in calling her a slut as your countrymen were in calling my wife a slut many years ago.

To:Feshangi

Yes you are old fashioned. Anyone who moved out of Iran in 1965 must be old fashioned. Sorry you are no more Iranian than Andre Agassi or Pierre Omidyar. The thread that linked you to Iran has long been stretched thin. Bahman is right the real Iranians are those living in Iran. The rest of us are of Iranian ethnicity. And really the only time we have to refer to our ethnicity is becasue whitey wants to know where our accent is from or someone is wondering about our complexion. And of course some of us are Persians and too cool to be Iranian.

I don't care what anybody says.

We can sit here and try to enumerate as many superlatives in Finglish as we want about "what's wrong with us", but when I meet an Iranian anywhere, any age, male or female, I treat them like gold. Heck, every other ethnic group is doing it! And if they act inconvenienced or mistrusting, then whatever, I tried, that's all I can say. I simply refuse to help out with our self-inflicted cultural genocide. Call me whatever you want, it won't matter, I can't bear that this problem exists and no amount of excuse making for it justifies it in my mind.

My last gasp for my people!